Author Topic: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS  (Read 25924 times)

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Matt__W

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #45 on: September 12, 2008, 04:47:47 PM »
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jnieman

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #46 on: September 12, 2008, 05:10:04 PM »
Like usual, you fail to read.

Thanks though.
My argument, and I think you miss it is; this standard would be more widely used and adopted if one did not need to literally 'buy-in' to use it. And that is my argument against charging for it. Most notably due to the fact it does nothing to protect life or property, thus rendering it nonessential. And as you and that other company clearly demonstrate irrelevant, and unnecessary to doing business.

Money isn't property?

mjfarrell

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #47 on: September 12, 2008, 05:51:35 PM »
Like usual, you fail to read.

Thanks though.
My argument, and I think you miss it is; this standard would be more widely used and adopted if one did not need to literally 'buy-in' to use it. And that is my argument against charging for it. Most notably due to the fact it does nothing to protect life or property, thus rendering it nonessential. And as you and that other company clearly demonstrate irrelevant, and unnecessary to doing business.

Money isn't property?

that property isn't yours until you earn it.

and from all appearances you nor your company use this standard you seem willing to construct straw men for

and not using it does not impact your ability to acquire that property
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jnieman

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #48 on: September 12, 2008, 05:55:37 PM »
It impacts my ability to earn that money if we stubbornly refuse to use a standard if our client demands it.

However, more specifically, I refer to the money -saved- by not making an overhead-only employee spend dozens and dozens of likely charged hours preparing a ground-up standard, and instead paying a nominal fee for an already-prepared standard.

You look at this standard as if it's supposed to be some globally enforced standard in coming...

Look at it as a marketed product... because that's pretty much all it is.  "Hey, don't waste time and money and billable hours doing something we'll sell you for cheap!"

You churn your own butter too?

mjfarrell

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #49 on: September 12, 2008, 06:11:11 PM »
It impacts my ability to earn that money if we stubbornly refuse to use a standard if our client demands it.

However, more specifically, I refer to the money -saved- by not making an overhead-only employee spend dozens and dozens of likely charged hours preparing a ground-up standard, and instead paying a nominal fee for an already-prepared standard.

You look at this standard as if it's supposed to be some globally enforced standard in coming...

Look at it as a marketed product... because that's pretty much all it is.  "Hey, don't waste time and money and billable hours doing something we'll sell you for cheap!"

You churn your own butter too?

If access to milk and churns were easier, probably.  However I eat little butter, and that isn't the discussion.

Your argument holds little credability. You state that a client asked that you use the standard, and you didn't. and it has not impacted your work with said client. So in fact you must be creating your own standard, and not using this one.  You said that you were not.

I have never implied an irrational fear that this standard will infact consume the world cad market.

I have repeatedly stated it's adoption would be faster and easier for most IF they could use it without need to buy the stupid book, given that autodesk is already stuffing our templates full of those layer names, etc.

Wouldst thou use the standard and argue it's merits from that vantage point.

Or wouldst thou argue that given the standard were five or ten times more costly than all would readily adopt it?
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Michael Farrell
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jnieman

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #50 on: September 12, 2008, 06:35:13 PM »
Your argument holds little credability. You state that a client asked that you use the standard, and you didn't. and it has not impacted your work with said client. So in fact you must be creating your own standard, and not using this one.  You said that you were not.


[1]I have never implied an irrational fear that this standard will infact consume the world cad market.

[2A]Wouldst thou use the standard and argue it's merits from that vantage point.

[2b]Or wouldst thou argue that given the standard were five or ten times more costly than all would readily adopt it?

1 - I got that impression (though I wasn't going as far as it being an irrational fear) because you compare this specific standard on equal grounds with other standards that ARE lawfully enforced by the government, trying to hold it to the same terms... so if it's apples to oranges, why must the apple be treated as an orange?  Why else would every point you try to make be about the standard being more widely adopted?

2 - I have no idea what the crap you're saying.  Would I use a standard and argue it's merits from what vantage point or would I argue that if the standard costs 5x or 10x as much it would be readily adopted?  What?

mjfarrell

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #51 on: September 12, 2008, 06:42:08 PM »
haha


no, we don't, though a couple company's that contract us, do, however, they never required us to follow it, for some reason.  Either they found our drawings to be of sufficient work-a-bility that they were ok with them, or .... I dunno.

Boss had me look into it briefly once, when we started work with those folks.



here is your citation, and I see that you choose to not use the standard. it was optional...


here is the deal, if you would use the standard then argue it's merits I'll wait.

otherwise my postion remains,  IF they would not charge for this thing more people might use it.

« Last Edit: September 12, 2008, 06:46:30 PM by mjfarrell »
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Michael Farrell
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jnieman

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #52 on: September 12, 2008, 06:45:03 PM »
no, we don't, though a couple company's that contract us, do, however, they never required us to follow it, for some reason.  Either they found our drawings to be of sufficient work-a-bility that they were ok with them, or .... I dunno.

Boss had me look into it briefly once, when we started work with those folks.

here is your citation, and I see that you choose to not use the standard. it was optional...

They use it... they never required us to... they never asked... we just got wind of them using it, and the boss was curious about it, and asked me to look into it independently.

Krushert

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #53 on: September 13, 2008, 10:13:08 AM »
I have never implied an irrational fear that this standard will infact consume the world cad market.
If you guys keep trying to smash you ideologies together; you might  just create a black hole that will consume the world cad market.  :-P  :-)
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mjfarrell

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Re: NEW NATIONAL CADD STANDARDS
« Reply #54 on: September 13, 2008, 04:49:23 PM »
I have never implied an irrational fear that this standard will infact consume the world cad market.
If you guys keep trying to smash you ideologies together; you might  just create a black hole that will consume the world cad market.  :-P  :-)

It could happen, as I think Josh has decided that irrespective of the discussion 'we' will disagree of late.
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Michael Farrell
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