Topic: "Open source software for architects"

[Mark]

When I began my career as an assistant architect 12 years ago, I used AutoCAD R12, 3D Studio, CorelDraw 6.0, and Photoshop 4.0 for architectural drawing and 3-D modeling. Today, many architects still use their later versions, but those bulky packages provide many functions an architect will never use. Luckily, there are several open source alternatives that are well-suited for architects -- QCad in place of AutoCAD, Blender instead of 3DMax, Inkscape in place of CorelDraw, and the GIMP as a substitute for Photoshop.

[ http://www.linux.com/feature/119278 ]

[Josh Nieman]

I use Gimp in replace of PS, because I don't use Photoshop type stuff often enough to warrant an expense of it, and the Gimp works just as well.

I know Blender can yield results that rival 3dsmax, C4d, or whatever else out there you may use.

I have no idea about Inkscape or QCad though...

I do know that if anyone has apprehensions about the quality or capabilities of open source software, there's no worry about that with Blender or Gimp... top notch stuff.

[quamper]

I really like Inkscape for what I've done with it. But then again someone who uses Illustrator or Corel more intensively may have a different opinion.

Scribus is a great desktop publishing app that wasn't mentioned

[LE]

The release of the QCad community edition follows a few months behind the professional edition. For example, the latest version of the community edition is 2.0.5.0, while the professional edition is at 2.1.3.2. The latter charges $33 for a single user. You can also download the demo version of the professional edition and use it for 100 hours with no function limits, though it shuts down once every 10 minutes.

QCad has strong tools for point, line, arc, circle, ellipse, polyline, NURBS, text, dimensioning, hatches and solid fills, and measuring. It can also use raster images, and has many other edit tools. The command line is under the main window, and you can accurately control your drawing here. In a word, an experienced architect can find all he needs for architectural plans.

On the down side, QCad doesn't support AutoCAD's DWG files.

No thanks!

[Mark]

The release of the QCad community edition follows a few months behind the professional edition. For example, the latest version of the community edition is 2.0.5.0, while the professional edition is at 2.1.3.2. The latter charges $33 for a single user. You can also download the demo version of the professional edition and use it for 100 hours with no function limits, though it shuts down once every 10 minutes.

QCad has strong tools for point, line, arc, circle, ellipse, polyline, NURBS, text, dimensioning, hatches and solid fills, and measuring. It can also use raster images, and has many other edit tools. The command line is under the main window, and you can accurately control your drawing here. In a word, an experienced architect can find all he needs for architectural plans.

On the down side, QCad doesn't support AutoCAD's DWG files.

No thanks!

It does support DXF though.

[Antisthenes]

DXF yuck!
segments ,  that is like mesh to NURBS.  approximation to accuracy,  segments of likes vs curves

i like the idea you are promotion Mark Thomas, alternatives, as we do need them
i say a better solution(s) are other tools:

i like Artweaver  in place of PS  , www.artweaver.de
 "     IntelliCAD    "        " "  Autocad   , http://www.softsea.com/review/ProgeCAD-LT-2006.html  (here is the free progecad 2006 LT)  see Intellicad.org for all the other 'partners/products'  ArchT, Architecturals etc
  "    Rhinoceros  "   "   "  "  Illustrator/max/autocad/indesign  (add Brazil , Maxwell, Vray, Fryrender, Indigo, Renderman, Flamingo, Penguin  .. to render and Bongo to animate )

Intellicad being Open source with linux versions in Bricscad and it has full DWG compatibility in OpenDWG that Rhinoceros also uses and does as far as DWG compatibility with all current standard conventions

sure they are no revit archicad microstation or vectorworks.    but there is tools like Archcut http://en.wiki.mcneel.com/default.aspx/McNeel/ArchCut.html for Rhinoceros as well as all the traditional methods we know and use from the past till now plus way more flexibility over the control of your geometry, florkflow plus all the more advanced objs you can make.

Interoperability


i am still stuck in one area i like the Adobe Acrobat PDF print driver the best even thou i know tools like   http://PDFCreator.sf.net that are open source exist too.

[daron]

Me, I'll take the original list with autocad. Blender rocks and the Gimp and Inkscape are great for what they do. I've tried bricscad, ICAD Architecturals, and Qcad and have found none of them to my liking.

[CADaver]

[Josh Nieman]

ok I'll do it.

Whatcha thinkin' CADaver?

[CADaver]

ok I'll do it.

Whatcha thinkin' CADaver?

I "was" thinkin I made a reply to this thread over the weekend.....

[Josh Nieman]

ok I'll do it.

Whatcha thinkin' CADaver?

I "was" thinkin I made a reply to this thread over the weekend.....

Musta missed it.  Guess that's what I get for not hangin' out here on the weekends.

[Jakes GrandPa]

ok I'll do it.

Whatcha thinkin' CADaver?

I "was" thinkin I made a reply to this thread over the weekend.....

I thought you did too, but maybe both of us are remembering things that never happened...

[quamper]

I get those email notifications about new posts after posting in a thread, I looked back through them in my trash folder and there was no reply from you over the weekend that I could find...

 :loco: ?

[CADaver]

oh well it was probably best......

[Atook]

Randy, It was a different thread I think.

I do wish we could get a good DWG compatible competitor. Competition is good, right Randy? Even if it's open source maybe?

[CADaver]

Randy, It was a different thread I think.

Nah that isn't it, I remembered that one.

I do wish we could get a good DWG compatible competitor. Competition is good, right Randy?

hmmm... oh? why?

Even if it's open source maybe?

Only if you're a programmer.  Look at something simple like Intellicad, how many different versions are there out there now, and which is "best"?  How much time do we burn finding out which is best?  And do we have to wait for Billy to get home from summer camp to repair an upgrade? Still unimpressed.

[MickD]

I do wish we could get a good DWG compatible competitor. Competition is good, right Randy?

hmmm... oh? why?

Better service and features driven by competition perhaps

... How much time do we burn finding out which is best?  And do we have to wait for Billy to get home from summer camp to repair an upgrade? Still unimpressed.

So, are you saying that you have none of these 'teething' problems buying or using your proprietary software??

[CADaver]

I do wish we could get a good DWG compatible competitor. Competition is good, right Randy?

hmmm... oh? why?

Better service and features driven by competition perhaps

Perhaps, perhaps not, there is a great deal of competition out there already if I believe what I read service has not improved much and the new "features" are "unnecessary".

... How much time do we burn finding out which is best?  And do we have to wait for Billy to get home from summer camp to repair an upgrade? Still unimpressed.

So, are you saying that you have none of these 'teething' problems buying or using your proprietary software??

I've never had a proprietary vendor give me the phone number of a high school kid for support, and that HAS happened to me for open source more than once.  Try explaining to the project manager of a multi-hundred-million dollar project he can't see graphics in his document because Bobby's mom grounded him from his computer for a week.

For AutoCAD, there's AutoCAD but for IntelliCAD, there's IntelliCAD and BricsCAD and ProgeCAD and ElcoVision and a host of other AutoCAD wanna-bes none any better than the other just "different" and equally unimpressive.  If that's all you want to draw, or you'd rather play with the program than build plants and refineries then cool, carry on.


BTW, my spell checker suggested cannabis for “wanna-bes”… might be on to something there……

[MickD]

... How much time do we burn finding out which is best?  And do we have to wait for Billy to get home from summer camp to repair an upgrade? Still unimpressed.

So, are you saying that you have none of these 'teething' problems buying or using your proprietary software??

I've never had a proprietary vendor give me the phone number of a high school kid for support, and that HAS happened to me for open source more than once.  Try explaining to the project manager of a multi-hundred-million dollar project he can't see graphics in his document because Bobby's mom grounded him from his computer for a week.

That's a bit of an over-generalisation if I ever heard one, I'd doubt you would speak to 'Bobby' when you rang Sun or IBM et al.

[CADaver]

... How much time do we burn finding out which is best?  And do we have to wait for Billy to get home from summer camp to repair an upgrade? Still unimpressed.

So, are you saying that you have none of these 'teething' problems buying or using your proprietary software??

I've never had a proprietary vendor give me the phone number of a high school kid for support, and that HAS happened to me for open source more than once.  Try explaining to the project manager of a multi-hundred-million dollar project he can't see graphics in his document because Bobby's mom grounded him from his computer for a week.

That's a bit of an over-generalisation if I ever heard one, I'd doubt you would speak to 'Bobby' when you rang Sun or IBM et al.

That may be, or not.  But I was sent to "Bobby" for a solution to and OpenOffice issue.... twice.  Therein lies my concern with open source, I just never know.

[Antisthenes]

open source is OK you just need to get used to it

get involved with the development

but I still like Rhinoceros better

[CADaver]

get involved with the development

Why? I'm not a programmer, don't want to BE a programmer, don't even want to hire programmers

but I still like Rhinoceros better

Really?, you don't say, gee I'd have never guessed.

[Maverick®]

but I still like Rhinoceros better

Really?, you don't say, gee I'd have never guessed.

What did one Hyena say to the other Hyena?

[Chuck Gabriel]

get involved with the development

Why? I'm not a programmer, don't want to BE a programmer, don't even want to hire programmers

but I still like Rhinoceros better

Really?, you don't say, gee I'd have never guessed.

What have you got against programmers anyway?  What have they ever done to you? 

[CADaver]

get involved with the development

Why? I'm not a programmer, don't want to BE a programmer, don't even want to hire programmers

but I still like Rhinoceros better

Really?, you don't say, gee I'd have never guessed.

What have you got against programmers anyway?  What have they ever done to you? 

Not a thing, great bunch of folks, like 'em all.  Nothing against Architects either, just don't wanna draw house plans for a lady that wants a sixty thousand square foot palace for the price of a one-holer porta-can.
Programming is not why we're in business.

[Antisthenes]

well,
i don't think i hyena(s) would have a chance against a Rhinoceros, it is the king of the jungle when it comes to the last water hole.

and i have no problem using Progecad 2006 LT or Open Office. rather than wasting __ on autocad and ms office

[Arizona]

well,
i don't think i hyena(s) would have a chance against a Rhinoceros, it is the king of the jungle when it comes to the last water hole.

...

Well except for the bacteria in the water hole.
Funny how something so small can take down even a Rhinoceros

[Josh Nieman]

well,
i don't think i hyena(s) would have a chance against a Rhinoceros, it is the king of the jungle when it comes to the last water hole.

and i have no problem using Progecad 2006 LT or Open Office. rather than wasting __ on autocad and ms office

What exactly am I wasting on Autocad?  My company seems to be making money using the software we have.  We seem to have plenty of time to do our jobs using the software we have.  Our users are easily trained to accomplish their work using our software.  Everyone who has come to work here has already had prior knowledge or even mastery of the software we have.

That... seems to take care of everything involved with the purpose of our software.

[Antisthenes]

well how much is your companies subscription and upgrade costs i would ask?

have you used Intellicad? there is no learning curve all the commands are the same,  it truly is a clone and can be free:

http://www.softsea.com/download/ProgeCAD-LT-2006.html

[Josh Nieman]

well how much is your companies subscription and upgrade costs i would ask?

have you used Intellicad? there is no learning curve all the commands are the same,  it truly is a clone and can be free:

http://www.softsea.com/download/ProgeCAD-LT-2006.html

Our subscription cost is the same as everyone else.  $800/seat/year or whatever the price is.  We have 6 seats.  That subscription cost is infinitely recovered by the support offered by the company we pay for, being a user of a program that boasts millions of users to which there are common discussion pools for which I would draw information, and nearly-universal acceptance from any company we work with, as well as the program being taught by most colleges/tech schools/universities from which would would possibly draw applicant drafters.  The very affordable subscription cost also comes with the support of our very knowledgeable reseller who continually offers training classes, seminars, demos, tech support, all of which is free, or has a menial cost (like chipping in a couple bucks for lunch for training classes)

But I think I already covered the fact that we use this software and it makes us quite a lot of money while we use it.  Then again, the overhead that this software incurs is not really where the dollars are.  We charge what we charge, not because we use "expensive" software... we charge what we do to cover liability, insurance, employee wage/benefits, profit margin, training, office material overhead, and all that jazz.  When it comes down to it... software is a small boat in a designing engineering firm, and to cause waves over such a dinghy thing, when we have tankers to worry about... is ludicrous.

[Antisthenes]

i would not give so much praise to acad personally and the support is more than 1/2 user complaints over there

i never having a class in it and being a master of it says how unvast it is to me,  long time use factored in of course.

esthetically upgrades to appease the stockholders
great that it has been here for us by times are changing and the anti-BIM movement and alternative solutions having their effect.
i thought this was the swamp....

[Josh Nieman]

i would not give so much praise to acad personally and the support is more than 1/2 user complaints over there

People tend to complain faster than they'd praise.  Besides, I'm not sure what you mean by "over there" because the subscription support is a one-on-one thing.. not a public thing.  If you mean the discussion groups, then that's NOT what I meant by 'support' by a long shot, 

i never having a class in it and being a master of it says how unvast it is to me,  long time use factored in of course.

I'm not sure what you mean by "unvast" .. I mean... I probably only use 20% of the commands and it does everything I need it to, just about.  Most all of my issues with the program are merely HOW it does it.

esthetically upgrades to appease the stockholders

Gotta keep up with trends, I guess.

great that it has been here for us by times are changing and the anti-BIM movement and alternative solutions having their effect.

I don't see how an anti-BIM movement will affect them at all.  Don't want a BIM program?  Get a non-BIM program... Need BIM?  Get one.  They don't offer only one solution.  I don't see that we will -EVER- need anything more than vanilla Autocad. 

i thought this was the swamp....

That's 1 point on the scoreboard.

[Maverick®]

i never having a class in it and being a master of it says how unvast it is to me,

Ever had a class in baiting?

[Josh Nieman]

i never having a class in it and being a master of it says how unvast it is to me,

Ever had a class in baiting?

 

...long time use factored in of course.

Practice leads to being a master!

[M-dub]

i never having a class in it and being a master of it says how unvast it is to me,

Ever had a class in baiting?

In what sense of the word? 

[CADaver]

well how much is your companies subscription and upgrade costs i would ask?

have you used Intellicad? there is no learning curve all the commands are the same,  it truly is a clone and can be free:

Its not even a good false clone.  Well over two-thirds of our customization and all of our 3D stuff fails to work with it.  Now I could spend several thousand dollars worth of development time making it work or I could buy the right stuff to start.

[CADaver]

i never having a class in it and being a master of it says how unvast it is to me,  long time use factored in of course.

Okay, sorry I gotta take the bait here.  I've been using the software for some twenty-three years (over fifty thousand production hours), have been a registered developer for much of that, been both an academic and industrial instructor of the program for nearly twenty years.  In maybe another ten years I might have mastered half the program.  My experience in the past with people who claim to have "mastered" the program means they know how to use maybe ten or fifteen percent of the capability of the program, usually much less than that.  So I have to ask, what is your definition of "being a master of it"?

great that it has been here for us by times are changing and the anti-BIM movement and alternative solutions having their effect.

You REALLY need to check industries OTHER than those trying to discredit the front-runners.  BIM is alive and QUITE well among those who can actually accomplish it, and is rapidly becoming the standard in many industries.  Of course those are industries with a lot more to count than the number of windows in a house.

i thought this was the swamp....

it is.

[MP]

<MusingToSelf> What if Clinton G. and Dean S. had a love child. </MusingToSelf>

[Kerry]

<MusingToSelf>Are there sufficient Mods on Forums</MusingToSelf>

[daron]

<MusingToSelf>Are there sufficient Mods on Forums</MusingToSelf>

Are you pining for the position?

[Kerry]

Nope, just positing the possible necessity at the realization of Michaels musings.


(see, I can do alliteration too )