Author Topic: Dimensions shall be kept fully associative  (Read 11519 times)

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t-bear

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2004, 02:27:59 PM »
Not if you were using PS & vports.... try this:
 [begin tutorial] Create a vport and scale your shaft to a workable scale....stretching the vport to fit. Now dim your shaft or whatever and move the dim text close to the left end, then copy the vport on top of its self.  Now hilight one vport and drag the RIGHT side to the left (near that dim we moved). Clear your grips and drag the LEFT side of the other vport  way off to the right and, while it's still hot, move it left, close to the first vport. Finally, place your break lines in PS, perp to the edges of the relevant vports!  Sounds complicated but it's really not. With a bit of practice you can create multiple vports to dim a series of holes or ??? in your shaft.   [/end tutorial]  
We use this method all the time and it works "a treat" as my down-under friends would say.

If you're interested, I could be persuaded to do a series of screen-shots showing the steps.......?

yyou

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2004, 03:45:45 PM »
Thanks for your tips T-bear.  That part was a gear shaft for M60A tanks that we worked on 12 yrs ago.  Now I am doing MEP.  Sometimes I use your Vports trick to show colunm bubble or to clear bkgd to make space for design notes.

Back to the topic, using your trick would fall into 2 debated issues:

The break symbol is part of dim stay in PS.  (Topic: Dim in PS?)

Part of dim laying separately.  Non-associated dim?

CADaver

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2004, 04:51:02 PM »
Quote from: Dent Cermak
Another case of different worlds. Some of us are dealing with a 24"x36" real world sized object while some of us are dealing with an object that covers MANY square miles. There's no way I can draw a map with associative dimemsions. Unless you want a REALLY big piece of paper.
ummm... your plotter won't plot to scale??  We do civil work that will cover many acres and use associative dims quite easily.
... or did I miss a joke somewhere?

CADaver

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2004, 04:52:46 PM »
Quote from: yyou
With a long object like a shaft we cannot show it all in a dwg because it is too long and too small to see.  We then have to blow it up and show a break line in the middle.  The dimension line of the overall shaft, by dim rules, has to contain a break symbol.  That dimension has to be exploded or non-asso in order to add break symbol on the dim line.
Now, we normally dim in PS, but if you dim in MS this can be done very easily with two viewports without fudging the dim.

Dent Cermak

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2004, 06:44:00 PM »
So, if your commencing point is 10,450 feet due west of the POB you draw the entire line and use associative dimensions? Doesn't leave much room for the topo does it? My clients prefer a scale of 1"=20' or 1"=30'. They don't really like 1"=1000'.
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t-bear

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2004, 07:52:47 PM »
YYOU...
The dim IS associative.  You are just looking at two ends through the vports.
If i get the time tomorrow, I'll do the screen-shots......

yyou

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2004, 09:36:39 PM »
Cadaver,  I agree that it is easy to do with 2 vps.  But we need to add the break symbol on the dimension line, because we do not show the entire object.  That brings up the tip T-bear offers.

T-bear, The dim is associative and counted as one entity.  Break symbol is another entity.  It requires both entities do 1 dimension.  I consider that a non-associated type. :lol:  I am picky, am I not?

CADaver

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2004, 12:29:08 AM »
Quote from: Dent Cermak
So, if your commencing point is 10,450 feet due west of the POB you draw the entire line and use associative dimensions? Doesn't leave much room for the topo does it? My clients prefer a scale of 1"=20' or 1"=30'. They don't really like 1"=1000'.
Gee, never heard of ordinates??

CADaver

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2004, 12:30:26 AM »
Quote from: yyou
Cadaver,  I agree that it is easy to do with 2 vps.  But we need to add the break symbol on the dimension line, because we do not show the entire object.  That brings up the tip T-bear offers.

T-bear, The dim is associative and counted as one entity.  Break symbol is another entity.  It requires both entities do 1 dimension.  I consider that a non-associated type. :lol:  I am picky, am I not?
I think you're reaching.

Dent Cermak

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2004, 08:36:03 AM »
no. we use "coordinates".
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t-bear

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2004, 10:55:24 AM »
Yyou said:  
Quote
The dimension line of the overall shaft, by dim rules, has to contain a break symbol.

Hmmmmm.... I just went through my "drafting for Industry" and a couple of other books.  In all of them it requires a break symbol on the OBJECT but none of them require a break symbol on the DIMENSION.  Soooo I assume that this is an in-house rule......  
Quote
That dimension has to be exploded or non-asso in order to add break symbol on the dim line.
 That's the beauty of this method.  You just place those break lines in PS.  My way the dim is still associative and if the part has to be lengthened/shortened, the dim changes with it.  Your way, you gotta start all over again.  That's counter-productive and a waste of a good drafters resources. (Thats just my opinion....didn't mean to "preach"....)
Quote
It requires both entities do 1 dimension. I consider that a non-associated type.
 Yhat's just a matter of syntax.  ADIMENSION is either associative or it isn't.  My way it is, your it is not. for the sake of this discussion, which comes more in line with "proper drafting standards"?

Dent Cermak

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2004, 11:10:24 AM »
T-Bear, my drafting book says ANY item broken and not drawn to full length must be so noted with the break symbol.
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hudster

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2004, 11:47:56 AM »
I'm very lucky with dimensions, so fat I've only had to dimension a few drawings, approx less than 1.5% of out total output.

Most of the dimensions I use are leader lines.  With the text attached I hasten to add.
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CADaver

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2004, 11:53:26 AM »
Quote from: Dent Cermak
no. we use "coordinates".
So do we, we just use ordinate dims to place them.

yyou

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Dimensions shall be kept fully associative
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2004, 02:06:44 PM »
T-bear

Quote
Hmmmmm.... I just went through my "drafting for Industry" and a couple of other books. In all of them it requires a break symbol on the OBJECT but none of them require a break symbol on the DIMENSION. Soooo I assume that this is an in-house rule......

That in-house rule was also called DOD-STD-1000.  Those military guys have their own standards... and guns too.  I had to do what they said.

T-bear
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That's the beauty of this method. You just place those break lines in PS. My way the dim is still associative and if the part has to be lengthened/shortened, the dim changes with it.


I did not say your way is bad.  In fact, like I said, Ive been using it now to show colunm buble....It is a matter of choices.  I do it my way because if you break the rule of associated dim why not just explode it and put in the symbol without violate another rule, dim in PS.


T-bear
Quote
Yhat's just a matter of syntax. ADIMENSION is either associative or it isn't. My way it is, your it is not. for the sake of this discussion, which comes more in line with "proper drafting standards"?

I'm not sure how the definition of associated dim state.  But my understanding is if a dimension has one piece in MS and another in PS then it is a non-associative.

T-bear
Quote
Your way, you gotta start all over again. That's counter-productive and a waste of a good drafters resources. (Thats just my opinion....didn't mean to "preach"....)

Why start all over again?  Can I stretch the object along with the dim? Then simply change the text.