Author Topic: 5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.  (Read 12138 times)

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CADaver

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #15 on: June 28, 2004, 02:34:56 PM »
Quote from: Keith
Isn't this true about most standards? There are good and bad reasons for each?
I think this is different, this is more like wich is better lines or arcs.  Two different tools with two different uses/applications.  Other "standards" topics like "plotting" to scale or layer naming conventions are more user preference based

MP

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2004, 02:58:13 AM »
My 2 cents.

Generally speaking we have outlawed attached xrefs simply because of the circular reference problems that result. While there may be unique situations that might benefit from attached xrefs, they are the exception, and as such, are treated that way, with a raised eyebrow I might add.

imo. :)
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CADaver

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2004, 07:45:18 AM »
Quote from: MP
Generally speaking we have outlawed attached xrefs simply because of the circular reference problems that result.  
That was resolved in R14.  Circular references are dropped, its no longer a problem.

MP

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2004, 10:07:41 AM »
Quote from: CADaver
Quote from: MP
Generally speaking we have outlawed attached xrefs simply because of the circular reference problems that result.  
That was resolved in R14.  Circular references are dropped, its no longer a problem.

It's no longer a problem if your not using r14. If we start a project with AutoCAD version x (which is specified by the client) we execute through to completion using version x, even if the project span 3 or more years, which they predominantly do.
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Keith™

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2004, 10:52:34 AM »
Boy that must really suck .. especially since there have been a few good improvements in later releases ... most notably in my work is the MDI environment
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CADaver

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2004, 10:59:01 AM »
Quote from: MP
Quote from: CADaver
Quote from: MP
Generally speaking we have outlawed attached xrefs simply because of the circular reference problems that result.  
That was resolved in R14.  Circular references are dropped, its no longer a problem.

It's no longer a problem if your not using r14. If we start a project with AutoCAD version x (which is specified by the client) we execute through to completion using version x, even if the project span 3 or more years, which they predominantly do.
We do the same.  We just got everybody up to R2002 last February.  About the same time we landed an R2004 contract.

MP

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2004, 11:06:44 AM »
Quote from: Keith
Boy that must really suck .. especially since there have been a few good improvements in later releases ... most notably in my work is the MDI environment

There is a spectrum of suckage spanning everything from what can be done by automation, to the impacts on xrefs etc, but, MDI isn't really one of them -- the size of the files we generally work with makes MDI impractical. Fortunately, (IINM) we have but one project with r14 dependencies, the balance are using 2002. It's great for me -- I'm finally able to exploit visual lisp and vba to a much higher degree (I did have Vital LISP for versions past) etc. :)
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Keith™

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2004, 11:14:02 AM »
Well, from what I have read, the size of your models would not work well with more than one open...
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CADaver

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2004, 01:11:24 PM »
Quote from: Keith
Well, from what I have read, the size of your models would not work well with more than one open...
our file sizes (20-40Mb) don't impact MDI all that much for us.  But we have some decent hardware, too.  P4, 3+Ghz, Gig of ram, 22" Flat CRT.  They'll slow down some with 5 or 6 files opened, but with 2 or 3 there's no noticable detrement.

t-bear

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2004, 01:15:58 PM »
CADaver.
Ours are at least that big and we keep 3 or 4 open all the time ... no problem.  Plot time is our biggest bug-a-boo. with some it can take 3 to 5 minutes to get a plot off and the 'puter's tied up.  I just gotta go peruse the Swamp or sumpin'  ... real bummer!!

Keith™

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2004, 02:19:45 PM »
:lol:
Proud provider of opinion and arrogance since November 22, 2003 at 09:35:31 am
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CADaver

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2004, 03:54:37 PM »
Quote from: t-bear
Plot time is our biggest bug-a-boo. with some it can take 3 to 5 minutes to get a plot off and the 'puter's tied up.  I just gotta go peruse the Swamp or sumpin'  ... real bummer!!
Really?? huh!  The only time I've seen a plot slowdown (that wasn't related to the network choking on something) was using a plethora of screened layers.  "Screening' more than a couple dozen colors seemed to choke down the plot sending considerably.

(.... he said as the thread wandered further and further into ...)

pmvliet

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2004, 09:35:11 PM »
As we have all learned, Attached or overlays are required for different purposes. The safer way is to use overlays. As for the comment about circular reference being resolved in r14, I had a problem just yesterday with this in 2002 files.

Attach will work well for certain situations where you don't want to keep referenceing the same set of drawings over and over again. Instead reference one file with all your reference's attached.

If you work with background files for different disciplines or parts of a job and you have 20-80 background files. If one file has all 80 attached in, where ever that one file get's referenced in, all 80 will follow. This may  not be effecient because you only needed to show 5 of the 80. Overlay would not allow the 80 to follow.

One thing that I have done in the past is create a referencing file. This file is a blank file with nothing but reference files attached. You can then use this file to populate your drawings with your normal set of files that need to be referenced in... your background files can still have reference's that are overlayed...

Pieter

CADaver

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #28 on: June 30, 2004, 10:19:07 PM »
Quote from: pmvliet
The safer way is to use overlays.
UNless you need it ATTACHed.


Quote from: pmvliet
As for the comment about circular reference being resolved in r14, I had a problem just yesterday with this in 2002 files.
"SINCE" R14, not "in" R14.  It was still a problem in R14.

We do it n R2002 all the time, you get an alert that there is a circular reference, CONTINUE?, you say yes and carry on.  What kind of problem are you having with it?

daron

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5. All XREFs shall be overlayed, not attached.
« Reply #29 on: July 02, 2004, 09:01:47 AM »
I use both attach and overlay. Most people and I speak for everyone in my office, doesn't understand the overlay concept as yet. They are both useful, but you have to think about what needs to convey and what needs to be dropped from ref 2 ref.