Author Topic: 4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.  (Read 7365 times)

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MP

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« on: June 24, 2004, 06:16:39 PM »
Obviously this is a pragmatic thing - if you have a field measurement of something, and the surveyor paced off a loose measurement (it happens, c'mon),  the drafting should reflect, but generally speaking, if an object is known to 10 feet long it should be precisely 120 units long [expletive deleted], not 119.1234!

Same goes for angular precision.

Thoughts?
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Slim©

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2004, 06:42:18 PM »
Very, true and your end points of lines should meet, no gaps or overlaps.
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Dent Cermak

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2004, 06:56:28 PM »
ALL lines shoud join and "list" out at exactly the correct bearing and distance.
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MP

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2004, 07:15:58 PM »
Quote from: Dent Cermak
ALL lines should join and "list" out at exactly the correct bearing and distance.

Agreed. Draw accurately, using objects snaps and other accuracy / drawing aids as appropriate.
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Eloquintet

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2004, 04:11:34 PM »
PRECISELY :!:
Dan

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CADaver

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2004, 10:44:49 PM »
is ther another way????

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2004, 12:26:35 AM »
Quote from: CADaver
is ther another way????




"Ohh, just sketch that in it doesn't need to be to scale."

How many times have I heard that one.

Then they say "It's faster not drawing to scale."

So, yes there is. It's just not accurate.
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Keith™

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2004, 12:50:33 AM »
Well, you know, I agree 110% (if you can do such a thing) but what really gripes me is when I receive a set of certified site plans that I must incorporate into my plans and I find out that after drawing the entire perimeter of the lot, starting at POB and continuing until persumably I am back to the POB, I find myself several feet off.....

The survey shows 247.80' N88D45'28"E and after drawing it I find it should really be 246.52' N88D44'08"E .... how can this be off by that much?

It is not possible to draw accurately without accurate information. So to that end, all objects must be drawn accurately and to scale (as close as accuracy is defined in the standard) I have worked places where .10 degrees was "close enough" but not for me.... where things were dimensioned at 1/4" precision, not me ...Oh well ... I am the rogue anyway
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CADaver

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2004, 03:36:26 PM »
Quote from: Keith
The survey shows 247.80' N88D45'28"E and after drawing it I find it should really be 246.52' N88D44'08"E .... how can this be off by that much?

It is not possible to draw accurately without accurate information.


We must also be aware of the actual limitations of construction as well.  Running survey numbers out 5 or 6 decimal places serves little purpose, much like calling for a machine tolerance that is impossible to achieve.

Keith™

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2004, 04:17:08 PM »
Quote from: CADaver
Quote from: Keith
The survey shows 247.80' N88D45'28"E and after drawing it I find it should really be 246.52' N88D44'08"E .... how can this be off by that much?

It is not possible to draw accurately without accurate information.


We must also be aware of the actual limitations of construction as well.  Running survey numbers out 5 or 6 decimal places serves little purpose, much like calling for a machine tolerance that is impossible to achieve.


Which is why we have tolerences.... but if boundary markers are required to be within .05' of their actual location, why do I continually get measurements that are .25' off? Or did I misinterpret/misread Dent's remarks concerning where markers are required to be placed?
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MP

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2004, 02:05:44 AM »
Please hear a friendly voice as you read this ...

Seems to me this discussion drifted into one of annotation, and while that's fine, imho I think it would be more beneficial if another thead discussed annotation issues like displayed accuracy separately.

This thread was about drawing accuracy, and as such, imho,  drawing accuracy should not be a function of presentation or annotation. In my experience as little or as much as that may be, data, be it models, or databases, tend to be used many different ways, and as such, it is best to maintain "it" in the most accurate manner possible - you an always dumb it down later. :)
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Slim©

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2004, 02:27:11 AM »
Quote from: Keith
Well, you know, I agree 110% (if you can do such a thing) but what really gripes me is when I receive a set of certified site plans that I must incorporate into my plans and I find out that after drawing the entire perimeter of the lot, starting at POB and continuing until persumably I am back to the POB, I find myself several feet off.....

The survey shows 247.80' N88D45'28"E and after drawing it I find it should really be 246.52' N88D44'08"E .... how can this be off by that much?

It is not possible to draw accurately without accurate information. So to that end, all objects must be drawn accurately and to scale (as close as accuracy is defined in the standard) I have worked places where .10 degrees was "close enough" but not for me.... where things were dimensioned at 1/4" precision, not me ...Oh well ... I am the rogue anyway



I believe that the discussion has stayed on track, if something is not drawn correctly, the annotation will be incorrect in the Civil/Survey field. The problem Keith is refering to is one that also involves the accuracy of the surveyor's calculations, if they aren't correct the drawing will not be accurate. I guess we could start a new thread reguarding the inaccuracies of surveyor calculations if you would like, but that would be somewhere other than CAD Standards.
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Dent Cermak

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2004, 10:06:27 AM »
In response to Keith's question above; The positional accuracy required by Mississippi Survey Regulations is 0.05 feet. If you are running into erros of 0.25 feet you need to turn that surveyor in to the State Board Of Registration. Again, i would refer you to Chapter 16 of the Florida administrative Code, Chapter 61G17-6, Minimum Technical Standards. i believe that you will find that an error of 0.25' is not acceptabele by anyones standards. DUDE that's 3 friggin inches off!! You guys need a new surveyor. We have an office in Maitland.  8)
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Keith™

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2004, 06:17:39 PM »
Quote from: Dent Cermak
In response to Keith's question above; The positional accuracy required by Mississippi Survey Regulations is 0.05 feet. If you are running into erros of 0.25 feet you need to turn that surveyor in to the State Board Of Registration. Again, i would refer you to Chapter 16 of the Florida administrative Code, Chapter 61G17-6, Minimum Technical Standards. i believe that you will find that an error of 0.25' is not acceptabele by anyones standards. DUDE that's 3 friggin inches off!! You guys need a new surveyor. We have an office in Maitland.  8)


I have had them off by FEET not mere inches....I once had a legal plat description obtained from a courthouse and when I went to draw that plat from the description, it did not even produce a polygon, the boundary as recorded would make a Z shape if platted out.

and Dude, I do not hire these bozos I am relegated to use the clients surveying data... many times it is pretty sketchy
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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2004, 06:28:56 PM »
Quote from: Keith
I have had them off by FEET not mere inches....I once had a legal plat description obtained from a courthouse and when I went to draw that plat from the description, it did not even produce a polygon, the boundary as recorded would make a Z shape if platted out.
Somebody needs a 'nad hammered.

Quote from: Keith
and Dude, I do not hire these bozos I am relegated to use the clients surveying data... many times it is pretty sketchy
Sorry to hear that, we have our own, and they really don't like re-doing it on their own time.

Keith™

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4. All objects shall be drawn precisely.
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2004, 06:46:11 PM »
Well, like I said, ours is such that we must use what the client provides or get it ourself. Many times I wonder if it would just be easier to have our own guy in house,  but then some perfectionist will send his stuff in that tends to restore faith in humanity.....
It is such a vicious circle sometimes ....
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