Author Topic: Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards  (Read 14452 times)

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M-dub

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2004, 05:42:41 PM »
Exactly.

A lot of these drawings are simple schematics and P&ID's, etc. so they're fairly simple drawings.  I mean, when I find drawings where people didn't know how to stretch or extend lines and simply add another line to the end of an existing one to make it longer, I always fix that kind of crap, but I'm not going to sit there and bring every drawing I work on up to standard.  It would just take far too long and I definitely couldn't justify it.  Like I said, as long as the engineers and maintenance crew can read it and that it's correct to what's out there in the field, they're happy.  All drawings created from scratch are drawn to the standard, but I was just kinda wondering what everyone else out there does.

daron

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2004, 08:33:02 AM »
I relate this topic to an experience washing dishes when I was younger. There was this pile of dishes from a party the night before that I had NOTHING to do with. For some reason it fell to my lot that I got to wash them. Being about 10 years of age and hating washing dishes as much as I do to this day, I battled against it, daydreamt of how to get out of it, got pounded on by my older brother because I wasn't doing it and eventually, after about 6 hours, getting it done. I later realized that if I had organized the pile into manageable stacks, it wouldn't have seemed so daunting and I probably could've gotten it done in half the time. I view this experience in work as well. If a drawing isn't set up correctly, (with few exceptions), it'll take longer to get it done than if I were to go through and organize it.

M-dub

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #17 on: August 19, 2004, 03:37:10 PM »
How about SNAP?!  What's your opinion of drawings not on snap (drawings that SHOULD be on snap, that is...)  Do you put them on snap?

daron

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2004, 09:09:39 AM »
I haven't used SNAP since school. I can understand drawing near 0,0, but on snap seems very archaic to me. We had a new guy at Pulte come in and try to show everybody the benefits of using snap. We all looked at each other and tried hard not to laugh. We told him, there are other ways that we prefer. Needless to say, he's the boss in training. That's a frightning thought. That was one of the things that finally convinced me that moving was a good idea.

M-dub

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2004, 09:14:29 AM »
So you see no need for snap?  What type of drafting do you do?
Creating instrument loops, electrical schematics, single line diagrams, etc. is made much easier and faster if everything is on snap.  I used to think snap was useless until I started working for an instrument / electrical engineering firm...
What are these 'other methods' you use?

Dent Cermak

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2004, 01:01:57 PM »
So how does one draw a line from the end point or midpoint of another line without using osnap ?? You just "eye-ball" it ? So basically, you drawing has no actual intersections? Here, you don't use osnao, we snap you home.

M-dub

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2004, 01:11:34 PM »
If you draw with SNAP = ON.

If the whole drawing is drawn on snap, you should only require Osnaps under special circumstances.

Of course, my reasoning for originally posting this question was due to finding many drawings that should have been drawn on snap that weren't....And yes, we find drawings done by mental midgets where they 'eye-ball' the endpoints, midpoints, etc. which angers us to no end.  In many cases, due to budget and/or timing issues, we'll fix only the areas affecting us as opposed to taking the time to basically redraw the entire thing.

For drawings not requiring snap to be on, then of course, we use Osnaps.  (By WE, I'm referring to the able-minded CADdie)

daron

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2004, 01:29:17 PM »
First of all Dent, just in case you've forgotten, Snap and OSnap are two different things. I hate snap as much as I do ortho. I use polar and Osnaps. To answer then the real question, "What are the other methods you use?". Besides osnap and polar, ever hear of coordinate entry. Snaps bounce you all over the place. I want a distance, I  select the point at which to draw, set a direction and type in the distance. Done. That's one example. There are more ways by using different combinations of tracking osnaps. Ever use the From osnap? That's a beauty. Tracking is too, but they've replaced it with Temp Tracking, which is not the same.

t-bear

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #23 on: August 20, 2004, 01:36:19 PM »
Snaps?  No way!  How do you use snaps in 3D?

If my tolerances/snaps are set to 1/16" and I've got a pipe run that's 36' 7 3/16" long, it's a WHOLE lot easier to use coord entry.

M-dub

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2004, 02:05:42 PM »
Alright, Alright...
I would have to agree with the snaps bouncing you all over the place, but in many cases (here), we actually WANT that.  Not in ALL cases, but here's an example of ONE.

I've turned the grid on to show you what I mean.  The grid is set to twice that of the snap setting.  It just makes for quick and easy...almost 'Zombie CAD' as I like to call it.  I realise that in many many other fields of drafting, snap would be of absolutely no use, but in ours, there is...

ANYWAY, (EXCUSE THE CAPS, BUT I AM YELLING) I JUST GOT A CALL FROM OUR OFFICE AND THERE'S SOMETHING ABOUT AN ALL INCLUSIVE TRIP TO FLORIDA OR CLUB MED OR SOMETHING FOR ALL EMPLOYEES!  SOMETHING ABOUT A REALLY GOOD YEAR FOR THE COMPANY OR SOMETHING.
If this is a joke, I'm going to kill!  I've gotta go anyway.  Good Ol' VB Training...Then Camping this weekend.
Have a great one, everybody.

t-bear

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #25 on: August 20, 2004, 04:09:33 PM »
Alright Mikie......



Try this with snaps on.......and this is a small, relatively uncomplicated system.......

Have a good weekend folks!

M-dub

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #26 on: August 20, 2004, 04:47:46 PM »
Ted, THAT is a good example of what NOT to use snaps on and I realised that from the beginning.  We have TONS of drawings like you've shown and snap is not used, but OSNAPs ARE.  This isn't an argument, I was just asking what you'd do in the situation where snap WAS required and it wasn't used properly...
Anyway, the thing I said about the free trip to Florida is TRUE!  See the e-mail from the boss below:

Quote
In appreciation of all our employee's efforts over the last year, Langtree would like to invite you and your spouse on a weekend retreat.
 
We plan to fly out of Detroit Airport on Friday, September 17 and return on Sunday, September 19.
 
We are planning to stay at the all inclusive Club Med Sandpiper Resort, in Port St. Lucie, Florida.
 
We need to book the trip on Monday morning, August 25.  Please confirm your attendance as soon as possible.
 
We hope everyone can attend.
 
 
Sincerely,

*the bosses*

P.S. More details will be available once we book the trip.

Have a great weekend everyone...I know I will!  :)
« Last Edit: January 11, 2007, 11:09:30 AM by M-dub »

OU-CAD

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Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #27 on: August 24, 2004, 06:46:24 PM »
If this is a drawing that will be used over and over for other projects AND the time to make these changes wasn't going to break the drafting budget and wind up losing money, I'd take the time to fix it.  It would save time and frustration down the line and probably make the drawing appear more professional.  

If this is a one-time deal, I wouldn't bother.  The most important thing is not whether the drawing is pretty; it's whether the guy in the field can build accurately from it.

It seems that too often the "prettiness" of the drawing sometimes takes a back seat to the clarity of the construction documentation.  I catch myself being as guilty of this sometimes as the younger guys I supervise.  It's a matter of keeping in mind that time is money and if it doesn't make it clearer for the guy in the field, it's a waste of time.

M-dub

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Re: Drawings That Have Deviated From The Standards
« Reply #28 on: January 11, 2007, 11:08:20 AM »
*bump*

Woah, didn't know this one went back to 2004!

I bumped this one because of some of the absolute garbage I'm working on right now... should we maybe start a new thread for it?  Is it even worth discussing anymore?
« Last Edit: January 11, 2007, 11:17:16 AM by M-dub »