Topic: Training

[kindra]

I'd like to start a discussion about training. My training amounted to a few classes at the local junior college, then I dove right into the 'business world; 
I thought that, without a degree, I'd be a minority.....boy, was I wrong.
What I'd like to know is, is it worth the money to get my degree? Is my money better spent with seminar-type training? And what are the good seminars, anyway, that aren't going to waste my time trying to sell me crap I don't even have the seniority to recommend?
I also know quite a few people that have taught themselves, but that's not really my style - I'd prefer a little guidance 
Also, should I look into coding? Is this really a worthwhile and marketable skill?
What about 3D?
Any thoughts and opinions would be most welcome......

[Greg B]

Just run away!

As far and as fast as you can!

Buy a tent and go live down in Key West.

Perform down by the docs.


*see what I mean?  I spelled docks as docs.  Computers are over taking me!*

[Arizona]

Pick a direction...
Anything you apply yourself to, you will learn.

I have been self-taught, and I have taught.
I have attended every possible seminar, Autodesk University, Bentley conferences, and am currently working on a degree.

Does this help?

In todays world, the really good pay usually requires that little piece of paper. JMO.

[Dinosaur]

What type work do you want to be doing with your drafting skills?  Are you interested in moving into a more specialized design position or staying with more generalized drafting?  Most importantly, do you respond more to a formal, structured approach to learning or do you do better by observing and doing?
Virtually all of my training came in the six years before I went to college in 1970.  Nearly all of the rest has been on the job, learn as I do it.  I had three worthless, 2 hour sessions from a CAD vendor when AutoCAD r10 was introduced into our office in 1990.  That was the end of my formal training until 18 months ago when I purchased my own Civil 3D training when it became clear to me that I could not teach myself what I needed to know about the program.  Others prefer the formal classroom approach . . . that is fine as well . . . what matters most is doing what works best for YOU.

[jonesy]

I'm in the UK, so it might be slightly different.

I have no professional degree, and I have never been out of work as a drafter. I had the 3 day AutoCAD training course when I first migrated from the paper world to the cad world. Microstation, I have never had a days training (I was on maternity leave when it was introduced at my workplace) I was just given the book and told to read it. I have also spent a couple of years teaching AutoCAD at the local college, and I firmly believe that you dont actually learn it until you are doing it in a real world situation, and being shown/guidend by someone who does the job.

But saying all that I am now part time studying, hoping to get a degree, but that is for personal "pat on the back" rather than any desire to move me up a ladder.

Programming??? I'm trying to learn, because I think its a worthwhile skill to have. TheSwamp has some of the best programmers who understand cad, and they are generous with sharing their knowledge... so my advice is, try it.

As for the 3d, if there are companies where you are that use it, then try to learn it. I'd love to get a job where I could do 3d work, but alas, we are firmly entrenched in the 2d world

BTW... welcome to theswamp

[TimSpangler]

I have a 2yr degree in CAD.  It does help but is not really needed (I have worked with people who are in the same position I am in, who merely have a certificate) I will add this though if you like living in the cubicle farm then you don't need a degree, If you'd like to live in an office someday the a degree is needed.  As far as coding goes, I would learn some sort of coding  that does help set you apart from your peer.  It shows that you have gone the extra mile.  Me personal feeling is (and I know some management also feels) that if you program in cad then you probably know cad better than someone who does not.

$0.02

TIM

[Krushert]

My two cents though I will just basically regurgitating what has already been said.

I have taken 3 semesters of Autocad training at the local community college.  The last class was a retake of the second class.  The classes were Basic & Advance levels.  I did this because the class is very good and I just changed jobs (from Microstation to Autodesk) so I wanted a refresher course.  I don’t have a formal piece a paper in Cad however I do have a cert in Pencil Drafting and Associates Degree from a previously life.  Ohh I did have a 2 day course in ADT 3.3 from a vendor.  What a joke IMHO. 

Tim S is right.  Find the training that works for you.  To me OJT and the community college course was what worked for me.  Plus I explore Autocad to find out what it can do, I admit, I am a curious and as a result a button pusher.  IN my previous life, I was never allowed near the stuff that controlled the guns.  I also find forums that have personality that matches mine and that has very helpful folk.  So find forums (or a power user in the office) and ask a lot of questions.  Coding helps because it forces you to understand some of the behinds the scenes stuff.

My Instructor for the advanced class stated on the first day of class “…that employer would be dropping a serious chunk of change on hardware, software & furnishings so you can play with cad so you better know how to play with it.” 

[kindra]

Thanks for all the wonderful advice, you guys. (Your two cents is in the mail)
We are required to come up with a 'training outline' articulating what we're interested in learning over the next year. I use both AutoCAD and MicroStation, although the department I'm in uses MS (but I've learned that, as drafters, we just do what needs to be done regardless of what department we're supposed to be in.) This leaves me in a tight spot - AutoCAD has all kinds of camps, etc. to offer, but it's not my department's platform (the head of which approves my training program), plus it's the program in which I'm more comfortable. On the other hand, the only things I can find along the lines of MicroStation training are three- to four-day seminars in Kansas and Florida, and it's a huge rarity that training requiring a flight and hotels is approved. This leaves me with junior college offerings, and there are only a couple classes that I haven't already taken. I am, however, signed up for Spring's MicroStation 101. We'll see how that goes......

Again, thank you! You guys are the best!

[Cavediver]

I have an Industrial Design degree, but I still started from the bottom of the pile.  The most relevant thing on my resume was my time at the college wood shop.  However, my degree did help me sell myself, and the things I learned have helped me along the way.  I did not need the degree to get where I am today, but I'm really glad I have it.

As far as AutoCAD is concerned, I've learned almost everything on the job or on my own time after work.  As a result, I'm pretty good at what I do for my industry, but I know very little outside of that realm.  I'm sure I have a lot of bad drafting habits, but there's no one around that can point them out... 

[Arizona]

On the other hand, the only things I can find along the lines of MicroStation training are three- to four-day seminars in Kansas and Florida,

Kinda hard talking them into a vacation training in Florida, huh?

On a more serious note, Bentley holds a conference once year that runs about $1200 +/- (plus air fare), the hotel was included. This year it was in Charlotte N.C. however next year it will be in L.A. http://www.theswamp.org/index.php?topic=12446.0
There is a variety of training by some pretty good (ok, at least two of them were great) instructors.
Otherwise if you are a Select member you can have access to additional training, support, etc...

Welcome to theswamp Kindra!!
We need more people that work with both Microstation and Autocad. I too work with both. Sometimes I find myself speaking this combination language ("Put that on this layer/level") depending on the audience.

So dive right into theswamp while the water is still warm... 

[sinc]

What I've noticed:

Many licenses require a four-year degree.  This varies from state to state and discipline to discipline, but it's something to keep in mind.

Also, having a degree counts much like a "reference" when seeking a job.  There are companies that won't even talk to a prospective employee who doesn't have a degree, no matter how qualified.  True, a degree may not really mean anything, but it at least indicates that you have enough follow-through to get a degree.  If you don't have a degree, you may have to prove that you aren't just "flighty".

And should the economy change and jobs get scarce, having at least a four-year degree can make it much easier to get a new job.  True, you may not need a job now, but that could change...