Topic: Found that Skype kills C3D 2011 has anybody else found this?

[sourdough]

Has anybody else found that you the point edit problem goes away when you take Skype off your machine.
Through 4 other computers that are at the office I work for, and the one at home we have isolated that
something in Skype is killing C3D 2011. I re-Ghosted my machine 5 times to prove it. Anybody else made
this connection. In fact, I haven't killed C3D 2011 since I removed it, and that includes hangs.

MJP

[mjfarrell]

what "point edit" problem are you talking about?

could be that the 'problem' is isolated only to the ghosting process of installing OS, and software

so the fact that it happens on 5 ghosted machines proves that perhaps GHOST is the issue not SKYPE...?

did you run a TEST of NEW hard drive, NEW OS installed from DVD
NEW CIVIL 3D installed AFTER SKYPE is installed without use of GHOST or any other disk imaging application being employed?

that would be a test that might conclusively prove your hypothesis

Do the above test and give us an update will you?

[sourdough]

what "point edit" problem are you talking about?

could be that the 'problem' is isolated only to the ghosting process of installing OS, and software

so the fact that it happens on 5 ghosted machines proves that perhaps GHOST is the issue not SKYPE...?

did you run a TEST of NEW hard drive, NEW OS installed from DVD
NEW CIVIL 3D installed AFTER SKYPE is installed without use of GHOST or any other disk imaging application being employed?

that would be a test that might conclusively prove your hypothesis

Do the above test and give us an update will you?

Mike, your assuming that the software was ghosted on 5 machines. I'll state this again. I tested my machine with before and after 5 times with my
machine with and without Skype. The office machines had Skype put on by the IT guy. Identical problems arose after the install on all machines. I'm 2600 miles away from them. I have seen other posts on other autodesk forums that sometimes the Point editor through the Point Group can hang and sometimes the Point Editor also was hanging when just touching the dialog box. This may be of use for other people. The biggest problem overall was that C3D just died over and over and it wasn't due to doing a point edit, now it doesn't. 

MJP

[mjfarrell]

I did not assume anything, your post was not very clear about your 'testing' methods; and that led me to the conclusion that your test was flawed.  Further in your rebuttal you did not indicate wether even on that one machine if you attempted any installs without use of GHOST or similar application, or if you tried different install order of the suspect and affected application.
Next week when I don't need to have my machine fully functional for training purposes, I will test this SKYPE issue using my own methods.
I have seen no such issue being widely raised by C3D users about SKYPE and point group edits causing any problems.

Again it could be an order of install issue, in that one should most likely install this SKYPE crap prior to installing C3D and then there might not be an issue at all.  Did you test that particular install order?  Skype first, then the C3D install?  
And or did their IT person (whatever their qualifications are) also install SKYPE first and then C3D without use of Ghost or similar?
Or do you even know what actual steps were taken; being X miles away makes me think not.

Until I do further testing on my own I will leave you to decide if you want to test the install order as a cause/solution to this.

Maybe others are open to an alternate solution whereas you may not, so my suggestion to test the install order might help them.

Interesting to note that a google of " skype point editor " only returns your post here; so this must be one massive problem for sure.
Other variations return no results of any note regarding C3D at all.  

[Jeff_M]

Interesting to note that a google of " skype point editor " only returns your post here; so this must be one massive problem for sure.
Other variations return no results of any note regarding C3D at all. 

Michael, I'm pretty sure Mike is only talking about the issue where the Point Editor will FE C3D2011. LINKAGE What he has apparently discovered is that he thinks Skype is likely the trigger component for the issue.

I will say that I've seen the crash on my older laptop, which happens to have Skype installed...among many other things. I just ran a quick test on this new laptop, which does not have Skype installed, and I have been unable to duplicate the crash....yet. I need to add Skype anyway (this is what I use to converse with my grandkids in Nebraska and Washington) so I will test again after that install.

Jeff

[Jeff_M]

Edit: I mis-spoke before...it's not an outright FE or crash, instead it is a full lockup. MORE LINKAGE

I installed Skype, set it up, quit. Ran Point Edit test, AOK. Quit C3D, started Skype, restarted C3D2011, ran Edit Point test....locked up fast & tight. Sounds like Mike may be on to something here. I uninstalled Skype, another test, still locks up....rebooting now.

[Jeff_M]

A reboot did not fix it, nor did a Repair install.

Nor did a System Restore  to yesterday's Restore Point.

[mjfarrell]

Jeff, you are also NOT testing a different install order with this.
Install SKYPE first
then
C3D
Then test.

You are basically 'testing' using the same method.  
I'm not saying it isn't happening, I'm saying that reversing the order of install could very well stop it from doing so.

It could also be that Skype, and the Autodesk Communications center are in conflict, and that turning that off could aslo prove a solution as well.

It also seems that there are issues directly related to the Video drivers at play here from your link.

[mjfarrell]

Here's a crazy idea...

Why not confirm that ALL those users having said problem with point edits in the Panorama actually HAVE Skype installed on the affected machines?

Then if the number is sufficiently high enough to be a majority; we can definitively blame Skype for the problem.

I suspect that it is NOT the root cause of the problem; while it may exacerbate the problem it isn't the cause.

[sourdough]

A reboot did not fix it, nor did a Repair install.

Nor did a System Restore  to yesterday's Restore Point.

Jeff, what you are getting is exactly what I have found. It may be video drivers are in conflict. I have used both ATI and Nvidia cards, and the result is the same. I used the 5.1 Skype, the latest. I can communicate with Google Mail Chat with video/audio and no problems at all.

MJP

[Jeff_M]

Jeff, you are also NOT testing a different install order with this.
Install SKYPE first
then
C3D
Then test.

You are basically 'testing' using the same method. 

Actually, my old laptop which I first experienced this on DID have Skype installed prior to C3D2011. I first started using Skype Thanksgiving Day, 2009....C3D2011 wasn't available until 5-6 months after that.

I also believe that Skype itself isn't the cause of the problem, but something it installs or alters in Windows is triggering the problem. I'm thinking it is probably a .NET file.

[Mark]

May be related.

If I try the following C3D crashes, every time! All I have to do is click on the point group in the prospector and *boom* no C3D! I cannot update my point group. I don't have Skype either.

Click COGO Point tabModify panelEdit Point Group List  .
 The Point Groups dialog box is displayed. Point groups marked with  are out-of-date.

In the Point Groups dialog box, click  to display information about the out-of-date point groups.

In the Point Group Changes dialog box, click  to update all out-of-date point groups.

Click Close in the Point Group Changes dialog box.

Click OK in the Point Groups dialog box.

[Mark]

Again it could be an order of install issue, in that one should most likely install this SKYPE crap prior to installing C3D and then there might not be an issue at all.

So what do you have against Skype?

[Mark]

May be related.

If I try the following C3D crashes, every time! All I have to do is click on the point group in the prospector and *boom* no C3D! I cannot update my point group. I don't have Skype either.

I can update my point group if I go through Points -> Edit Points -> Point Group

[mjfarrell]

Again it could be an order of install issue, in that one should most likely install this SKYPE crap prior to installing C3D and then there might not be an issue at all.

So what do you have against Skype?

Nothing unless it in fact the cause of this issue, and then it is CRAP.

Although at this point SKYPE is merely a red herring and not the sole cause of this issue; considering all of the facts available to me.  IMO

[mjfarrell]

WE, just had about 45% of the PCs in class crash from the point edits in Panorama issue.  As these are NOT my computers to care for, I can not tell what hardware is installed to restrict the 'cause' to a single hardware provider or driver version for same.

Not one single one of them has SKYPE installed.

That is enough evidence for me to assert that SKYPE is in no way, responsible for the problem.

Unless it's (SKYPE) very existence in the universe is enough to affect ALL installations of C3D no matter what their location in said universe happens to be.

[sourdough]

WE, just had about 45% of the PCs in class crash from the point edits in Panorama issue.  As these are NOT my computers to care for, I can not tell what hardware is installed to restrict the 'cause' to a single hardware provider or driver version for same.

Not one single one of them has SKYPE installed.

That is enough evidence for me to assert that SKYPE is in no way, responsible for the problem.

Unless it's (SKYPE) very existence in the universe is enough to affect ALL installations of C3D no matter what their location in said universe happens to be.

Well, Mike it seems that Jeff might have a part of the answer that most suits me. I think it is a .NET issue and makes sense enough that my solution of removing it solved my issue. It may not solve your issues, but it may give some other a solution that does count. Of course, it isn't to say that Autodesk never codes wrong. I welcome your investigation that would help all of us understand what is really going on. Some solutions are better than none. Be it scientific logic or good old trial and error investigation. I only can say at this moment after doing what I did I haven't been able to crash C3D 2011 for the last 2 weeks after finding this out. It is my luck.

MJP

[mjfarrell]

yes it may be a DOT net issue and EXACTLY why I was suggesting that the ORDER of installation of the application(s) were the cause of the problem NOT the application itself.

Because by installing C3D AFTER everything else it should have installed the DOT net files it would be happiest using.

Funny if you had read my post, and ran the test I suggested instead of defending your methods you might have found the DOT net files were correctly written by installing the application(s) in a different order.

[Jeff_M]

Maybe you missed my post, Michael, where I explained that the first PC I experienced this problem with did have the order of installation reversed, as you suggested. And it still crashed.

FWIW, I have the passed this info on to Autodesk. Himanshu Gohel has responded and will be running his own tests now with the data I have supplied him with.

[mjfarrell]

Maybe you missed my post, Michael, where I explained that the first PC I experienced this problem with did have the order of installation reversed, as you suggested. And it still crashed.

FWIW, I have the passed this info on to Autodesk. Himanshu Gohel has responded and will be running his own tests now with the data I have supplied him with.

Actually it appears that your order of install was SKYPE first and THEN C3D.  And I mis-typed the test method order.  Perhaps I confused you with that error.  

However good to know somewhat at autodesk might actually look into the issue.  Although upon waking this AM I conclude this is NOT a problem Autodesk will do anything about, unless they own shares in SKYPE they have no reason to address an issue caused by some other software(s) other than their own.

Jeff, you are also NOT testing a different install order with this.
Install SKYPE first
then
C3D
Then test.

You are basically 'testing' using the same method.  

Actually, my old laptop which I first experienced this on DID have Skype installed prior to C3D2011. I first started using Skype Thanksgiving Day, 2009....C3D2011 wasn't available until 5-6 months after that.

I also believe that Skype itself isn't the cause of the problem, but something it installs or alters in Windows is triggering the problem. I'm thinking it is probably a .NET file.

[sourdough]

Jeff, you are also NOT testing a different install order with this.
Install SKYPE first
then
C3D
Then test.

You are basically 'testing' using the same method. 

Actually, my old laptop which I first experienced this on DID have Skype installed prior to C3D2011. I first started using Skype Thanksgiving Day, 2009....C3D2011 wasn't available until 5-6 months after that.

I also believe that Skype itself isn't the cause of the problem, but something it installs or alters in Windows is triggering the problem. I'm thinking it is probably a .NET file.

Jeff, this should be interesting to check and see what version of .NET Framework is installed. Here is a snapshot from Registry.
Win 7 64bit (C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319\)

[36years]

A similar issue: I found out about a year ago that some anti-virus (Symantic) can totally ruin your C3D day. Uninstall it if you can, find something else.
Actually, I was searching for an answer for another topic, but I found this and thought I would throw in my $0.02 on a lockup issue.