TheSwamp
CAD Forums => Vertically Challenged => Land Lubber / Geographically Positioned => Topic started by: drizzt on August 19, 2010, 10:31:51 AM
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I have a profile view that is split for sheet sets. On one of these views (first view) I need to lower the datum so that I can add stuff that would currently be below the lowest elevation grid. I went to the elevations tab in the profile view properties. I have user specified height selected, but I can't change the minimum elevation, its greyed out. I looked in the help, but found nothing.
Can anyone help?
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you may need to use your profile layout tools and create some profile by layout, or pipe objects at or below the elevation in question in the PARENT profile, that those reference profiles were created from....
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you may ALSO need to change the style of the profile view you are using...
my guess is this: The profile view style you are using was NOT created by yourself from scratch...and you are using one of the autodesk supplied styles...and IT is NOT going to adjust to the lower datum...until you create your OWN style....and use for your profile views.
Don't ask me why; or I will start typing things that 'others' don't want to see....
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also verify this setting in your profile view creation
Profile View Datum By
Specifies how to place the datum for all profiles within the profile view.
•Minimum Elevation—All profile datum values are based on the lowest datum value of all profiles in the profile view. This option works well for profiles that have relatively high variation in elevation.
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ok, I am going to try to teach myself the pipes for the culvert I need to show, hopefully that will fix my datum problem, and it will make adding pipes much easier. 1st problem is that in the network parts list I see a 12" cmp, but no 18" and I can't figure out how to get an 18" pipe. I can change the 12" to 18", but it doesn't give me the option to rename it 18". Any help?
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ok, I am going to try to teach myself the pipes for the culvert I need to show, hopefully that will fix my datum problem, and it will make adding pipes much easier. 1st problem is that in the network parts list I see a 12" cmp, but no 18" and I can't figure out how to get an 18" pipe. I can change the 12" to 18", but it doesn't give me the option to rename it 18". Any help?
Partslist...
Add Part Family (you've done this)
Rt-Click ADD Part Size...go get the 18"
Use in network
and a double click action while in parts list creation WILL allow one to rename the parts to anything one wants.
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Don't ask me why; or I will start typing things that 'others' don't want to see....
OK, now I am curious. And I am probably one of those 'others', but I would like to see what you have to say regarding this. If you want to spare other 'others', shoot me a PM.
Thanks!
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Don't ask me why; or I will start typing things that 'others' don't want to see....
OK, now I am curious. And I am probably one of those 'others', but I would like to see what you have to say regarding this. If you want to spare other 'others', shoot me a PM.
Thanks!
It's more a matter of 'WHY'; as in why would autodesk ever even put a style in the default DWT's that WILL NOT adjust properly when the elevation of items within the profile are lowered? It's unfathomable (to me at least) unless they just want to mess with people.
And you'll know if the profile view style you have is one of theirs that DONT WORK properly, grab hold of a pipe, or Vertical alignment tangent..and drag it downwards and try to go below the grid....when the profile view chops the element off at the Datum line; and will NOT adjust to include the new lower elevation of the object. You too will wonder the same thing...WHY?
Now should the user create their own profile view style they will not exhibit this behavior. (And I'm pretty sure you've seen it too, haven't you?)
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never mind, found add part size.
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I have seen occasions where, changing the Parent Profile view style to be AUTOMATIC, and then resetting it back to Manual will expose the option to lower the datum.
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ok, I am going to come back to this, but I am going to do another post for creating pipe networks
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ok, I am going to come back to this, but I am going to do another post for creating pipe networks
before you do; you might find it helpful to watch the pipenetworks feature settings tutorial on my website. (it could save you 20 questions).
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You too will wonder the same thing...WHY?
Now should the user create their own profile view style they will not exhibit this behavior. (And I'm pretty sure you've seen it too, haven't you?)
Yes, I've seen this, but only with split profiles. However, the use of a 'stock' style or my own doesn't seem to affect whether the view adjusts or not....it never adjusts for anything BUT a change to the EG profile. It's like the Automatic part of SplitProfiles only recognizes Dynamic profiles. I must add that I have only experienced this in testing, as I have yet to need a split profile for my own work...I haven't had a project with more than 15' of relief in probably 12 years.
So is this what you are seeing? How is the use of a self-created style helping this (I don't recall there being any settings in the styles that would factor into this)?
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I used the styles that came with Civil 10.
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I used the styles that came with Civil 10.
and many of these are set such they do not adjust the grid (manual vs automatic) for profile height calculation
I demonstrate the difference between a user defined style and a stock style in my classes.
Leaving most asking the same question; WHY would they define the styles that way.
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It's like the Automatic part of SplitProfiles only recognizes Dynamic profiles.
jeff,
in the profile view properties, on the profiles tab, you can choose which profile the splits will be calculated for.
(http://content.screencast.com/users/jugglerbri/folders/Jing/media/ac21b5a7-42e7-4bfd-b60c-106e7e59f131/2010-08-19_1243.png)
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once I get my culverts designed, and redo the sheet set, I will try this.
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once I get my culverts designed, and redo the sheet set, I will try this.
I'm almost sure that part isn't going to solve the issue you have with the datum not being low enough...
getting the pipes into the parent profiles however will.
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cool, cause that is what I am doing first
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It's like the Automatic part of SplitProfiles only recognizes Dynamic profiles.
jeff,
in the profile view properties, on the profiles tab, you can choose which profile the splits will be calculated for.
Ah Ha! The things that get glossed over when one doesn't need them sometimes are the most obvious. Thanks!
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It's like the Automatic part of SplitProfiles only recognizes Dynamic profiles.
jeff,
in the profile view properties, on the profiles tab, you can choose which profile the splits will be calculated for.
Ah Ha! The things that get glossed over when one doesn't need them sometimes are the most obvious. Thanks!
And hidden right there in the tutorial of all places, right? ;-)
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Thanks, Michael. As I said, I don't use SplitPV's so it hasn't been on my radar to learn or figure out. But while I'm learning so much today, I still haven't seen why using a homemade PV style vs a stock style helps any of this.
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Thanks, Michael. As I said, I don't use SplitPV's so it hasn't been on my radar to learn or figure out. But while I'm learning so much today, I still haven't seen why using a homemade PV style vs a stock style helps any of this.
As stated, some of the stock profile views are set in such a fashion...that they are NOT dynamic, with regards changes to the PGL. And when one drags any design element BELOW the calculated datum the grid does not adjust and the design element line is CHOPPED OFF.
Monkeying around with changing the setting from USER specified to Automatic...sometimes cures this, other times not.
As such I advise against using the stock profile view styles. That being said, having encountered this undesirable behavior since the initial beta release, I can honestly say I have not tested to see if this is resolved in 2010/2011; although I'm a little skeptical that it has. because I'm certain that Adesk would consider this behavior 'as designed' and not as a flaw or defect so most likely would not have altered their functionality.
Aditionaly I have found that by not using any of the stock styles for anything, one learns C3D faster, and has a deeper understanding of how and why things work, or not by setting up all styles from scratch. As they say YMMV.
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I'm going to pay attention to that on the next go around!
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NOTE: The undesired effect occurs with the parent profile, not provile view splits as in theory one would never be dragging vertical alignment elements around in them.
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nothing seems to work, so, I drew in a profile line below where I wanted the grid to clip at. I chose to clip the grid there, but not to draw it in the sheets......
nope... no dice
I am just going to go with the grid as is and drag the labels
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ok, you have to draw the profile drawn for grid clip only when creating the sheets, but then turn it off in the sheet set
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ok, you have to draw the profile drawn for grid clip only when creating the sheets, but then turn it off in the sheet set
NO, you need to STOP using the Adesk supplied profile view styles, as indicated in several of my responses regarding this issue.
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I tried to create my own from scatch. It did not work!
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I tried to create my own from scatch. It did not work!
Did you do it my way?
If Yes, did you apply said style to ALL Profile Views?
Or just whatever seemed to be the way?
As I said...Intuitive as an Anvil; No?
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As far as I know I did it your way. I created 3 profile views from scatch. first intermediate and end.
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So, you started with a COPY of the STANDARD profile view style...
and modified colors, layers and linetypes to suit your needs...
and then you used that style for your split profile view styles?
Me thinks you are missing something that I can't see in anything that you have typed here, and without a copy of your file further trouble shooting is going to be a bit difficult unless you post some screen shots of your settings, the results of same, and or a copy of one of your files in my inbox. (see profile for address, or request FTP site data through PM should you feel the file is too large as is.)
I'm not quitting on you, although without more information it's going to be harder to solve.
As it is my birthday, hows about a 'gift' of the data; just to make it easier on me to help you today only? ;-)
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here you go!
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ps i did not copy standard, I created new
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take a hard look at this
Use this page to specify the profile view height and any split profile view settings.
Profile View Height
Automatic
Specifies the full height of the highest profile. Includes a buffer region above the maximum and below the minimum elevations.
User Specified
Specifies the height to which the profile view is drawn. If a profile extends beyond the user-specified value, it is either split according to the Split Profile View settings or clipped.
Profile View Datum By
Specifies how to place the datum for all profiles within the profile view.
•Minimum Elevation—All profile datum values are based on the lowest datum value of all profiles in the profile view. This option works well for profiles that have relatively high variation in elevation.
•Mean Elevation—Profile datum values are based on the mean value of all profiles drawn in the profile view. Profiles are drawn in the center of the profile view, which places an equal amount of space above and below the profile in the profile view. This option is useful in profiles that have relatively little variation in elevation.
Split Profile View
NoteThe Split Profile View settings are enabled only if the Profile View Height is set to User Specified.
Split Profile View
Specifies that if the height of the profile extends beyond the User-Specified height value of the profile view, the profile view splits.
could it be you are specifying a height that simply will always result in clipping (off the data you need to see)?
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here you go!
thanks for that...will examine upon return from meeting!
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OK, from what I can tell the reason you are not or were not seeing your pipes in the profile views is related to their STYLE, and the fact that they are PERPENDICULAR to the alignment (I think I used the correct one)
You need to turn ON the Crossing Pipes display components within the style. And then you will see the pipes crossing under the alignment.
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For some of the Profile views one might still want to use the information on the Elevations Tab (Profile View Properties Dialog Box)
to adjust the datum and grid height to better center the design information within the grid
Split Profile View
Selecting Split Profile View enables the Automatic and Manual controls.
Manual
Splits the profile view at user-specified locations and allows using a different style for each split segment.
No: Sequential number of split segments.
Split Station: Starting station value of each split location. The split station of segment number 1 is the starting station of the profile view and is not editable. Enter a specific value or click to select a location on the profile view.
Adjusted Datum: Vertical split location. Enter a specific value or click to select a location on the profile view.
Profile View Style: Style selection of each profile view segment.
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I'm also thinking that during the creation stage, one should pay particular attention to the Automatic elevations; then when one enters the manual elevation data enter a number that is at least as deep (low) or deeper than the lowest invert -10. Try that out and see if the results aren't a little more satisfactory straight out of the gate. (as shown in image in last post)
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will give it a shot
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another option, include MORE cell padding below the DATUM in the PV style.
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I did try this before, it updated in my master file, but not in the sheet set. Yes... I did change the cell padding in both files for all profile view styles.
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I did try this before, it updated in my master file, but not in the sheet set. Yes... I did change the cell padding in both files for all profile view styles.
Sounds like I need to watch what you are doing; up close and in person.
Although it probably isn't your fault...
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of course its not my fault. Im the smartest guy I know, just ask me and I will tell you! :lol:
ok. I am creating another sheet set and I am at the create sheets wizard, prfile view Height and everything is greyed out. I can't change anything. Is this what you were talking about?
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>click< Hey who turned on the lights! >click<
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of course its not my fault. Im the smartest guy I know, just ask me and I will tell you! :lol:
ok. I am creating another sheet set and I am at the create sheets wizard, prfile view Height and everything is greyed out. I can't change anything. Is this what you were talking about?
Say...why don't you send me some screen captures whilst you practice your process in a document to my email.
Perhaps there is a clue in the pictures that your words don't contain, or I can't read. Then if there is something to share I'll post it back here...
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I would love to, but I just completed this stage of the process. If I remember to do it on the next round, I will do that!
I need to get approval to get you out here to Colorado!