Author Topic: Xref - Loading Startup  (Read 5887 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Xref - Loading Startup
« on: March 23, 2016, 12:30:43 PM »
I am guessing the answer to this is no, but I want to know if there is a way (When you open a drawing that has xrefs in it, that it does not load any of the xrefs at startup.) I do not know if there is a reactor that can do this as well. Just thinking about the most obvious way to speed up opening drawings, specially when you have a lot of users! lol. Thanks for any ideas on this one.
Civil3D 2020

Rob...

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 3824
  • Take a little time to stop and smell the roses.
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2016, 12:43:23 PM »
Sure there is. Unload them prior to saving.
CAD Tech

Jeff_M

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 4094
  • C3D user & customizer
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2016, 12:52:37 PM »
This won't prevent them from loading, but can speed up loading. What is your XREFLOADCTL set to?

Turns xref demand-loading on and off, and controls whether it opens the referenced drawing or a copy.

Value   Description
0      Turns off demand-loading; the entire drawing is loaded.
1      Turns on demand-loading. Referenced drawings are kept open and locked.
2      Turns on demand-loading. Copies of referenced drawings are opened and locked; referenced drawings are not locked.

When XLOADCTL is set to 2, a copy of each referenced drawing file is stored in the folder specified by the XLOADPATH system variable or the temporary files folder (set in the Options dialog box).

Additionally, xrefs load faster when you work across a network: the performance enhancement is most pronounced when you open drawings with many xrefs.

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2016, 12:53:39 PM »
use PARTIAL OPEN

one of the options is to NOT load xrefs....

and or IF your xrefs are on a unique layer- that layer could NOT be opened...
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2016, 12:54:08 PM »
also look at xloadctl
and indexctl
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2016, 01:01:48 PM »
Indexctl = 3

xloadctl = 2
Civil3D 2020

ChrisCarlson

  • Guest
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2016, 01:14:09 PM »
Best bet is to probably put each xref on a unique layer and turn layers off prior to closing.

Rob...

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 3824
  • Take a little time to stop and smell the roses.
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2016, 01:20:26 PM »
Best bet is to consider Jeff M's response. Other options might sound good in theory but would actually be problematic in the long run.

Are all the XREFs being stored on the network?
CAD Tech

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2016, 01:23:59 PM »
Yup all dwgs xrefs are stored on our network.

 I am curious about partiaload.

 I did try to open a file up, but the partiaload dialog box did not appear. it just opened the drawing like normal.
Civil3D 2020

BlackBox

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 3770
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2016, 01:40:09 PM »
I did try to open a file up, but the partiaload dialog box did not appear. it just opened the drawing like normal.

I've literally never (not once) seen Partial Open work as described.

I tried it a while back for the first time, as an XREF has myriad COGO Points, etc. that can take  f o r e v e r  to open in the middle of a tight deadline with last minute changes from my Engineer - didn't observe ANY change in behavior at all from what you'd see opening normally via SSM, etc. :|

"How we think determines what we do, and what we do determines what we get."

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2016, 01:42:25 PM »
I was just doing some reading....

Code: [Select]
Solved! by AllenJessup. See the answer in context.







Kudo. .


Autodesk has confirmed that Partial Open does NOT work on any drawing that has AEC objects in it. It should work on a drawing that was created in Basic AutoCAD. But once that drawing is saved from Civil 3D it wont work.

 

A request has been sent to update future Civil 3D help files to make this clear.

 

Allen
..


Solved! by AllenJessup. See the answer in context.







Kudo. .


A final word. I was still having problems with partial open even when the drawing was created by the basic version of AutoCAD that came with IDSP. Autodesk support traced the problem to the fact that the Civil 3D Object Enabler is installed during the installation of IDSP. The only way to create a drawing in base AutoCAD from IDSP is to turn DEMANDLOAD off. Then create a new drawing.

 

Allen
Civil3D 2020

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2016, 01:49:12 PM »
Brillant! 

Way to ensure product interoperability...

Let's create tools that don't work with all our products!

Thank you so much autode$k!
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2016, 01:51:56 PM »
Geesh, you would think somebody might of had a fix for this. lol. But you are right... I just need to use Basic AutoCAD to get the command to work.
Civil3D 2020

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2016, 02:06:52 PM »
Geesh, you would think somebody might of had a fix for this. lol. But you are right... I just need to use Basic AutoCAD to get the command to work.

Let's see, combine the fact that MAP will not touch anything from C3D, and this...
one has to wonder, do the product development teams never ever talk to each other?

And or add in the various export file options that then do not line up with the other program(s) import options, it's all so
much like they hired f' Borat or his brothers to do their product integration. (or lack thereof)

Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

dgorsman

  • Water Moccasin
  • Posts: 2437
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2016, 02:35:06 PM »
Yup.  Lets leave something in place which could royally screw over the data in a Civil3D file.  Sure.  Makes sense.  Then the users can complain how that was screwed up instead.  Or users can attempt to understand that things are done for a reason other than to annoy them. :tickedoff:
If you are going to fly by the seat of your pants, expect friction burns.

try {GreatPower;}
   catch (notResponsible)
      {NextTime(PlanAhead);}
   finally
      {MasterBasics;}

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2016, 02:41:05 PM »
Yup.  Lets leave something in place which could royally screw over the data in a Civil3D file.  Sure.  Makes sense.  Then the users can complain how that was screwed up instead.  Or users can attempt to understand that things are done for a reason other than to annoy them. :tickedoff:
OR....
They could make is so it works with all their products without screwing anything up OR annoying their users....




.......yeah, but that might just make too much sense, and NOT annoy anyone

so let's not do that, OK?
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

BlackBox

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 3770
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2016, 02:48:28 PM »
Yup.  Lets leave something in place which could royally screw over the data in a Civil3D file.  Sure.  Makes sense.  Then the users can complain how that was screwed up instead.  Or users can attempt to understand that things are done for a reason other than to annoy them. :tickedoff:

Well, I certainly don't want that either, as I'm sure you already knew.

Never worked in vanilla AutoCAD before, so I've just never used Partial Open - never needed to in Land Desktop, as it opened drawings as quickly as AutoCAD thanks to external DB.

I'll start looking into this more, merely so I can make useful reports to the development team elsewhere, but methinks this may be originating from the internal DB from the outset. *speculation*

What I would like to see from this, as they're never going to backtrack to an external DB again (which is a shame, IMO; would be much easier to manage Styles, etc. across directories of drawings), is to allow demand loading of XREFs that do not provide AEC Objects that are currently being  referenced - Station Offset labels from an XREF Alignment, as example.

Not sure; just feel that there's an achievable interim from nothing at all. *shrugs* Haha
"How we think determines what we do, and what we do determines what we get."

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2016, 03:07:30 PM »
I might be able to help with some number benches. Usually we data reference our pipe networks and surfaces into a sheet file. All of the existing information and title blocks, proposed base are xref'd into the sheet.

So a basic load time with everything in there is 50 seconds. If I unload all the xref's I can load the drawing in 20 seconds.
Civil3D 2020

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2016, 03:26:46 PM »
I might be able to help with some number benches. Usually we data reference our pipe networks and surfaces into a sheet file. All of the existing information and title blocks, proposed base are xref'd into the sheet.

So a basic load time with everything in there is 50 seconds. If I unload all the xref's I can load the drawing in 20 seconds.

wondering what those load times would look like on anything approaching a minimum specification workstation?  (not that anyone should be operating on one)
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

BlackBox

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 3770
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2016, 05:07:50 PM »
Wonder what those load times would look like following an EXPORTTOAUTOCAD (keeping the C3D drawings for future changes + subsequent EXPORTTOAUTOCAD)..? :evil:
"How we think determines what we do, and what we do determines what we get."

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2016, 05:11:26 PM »
Wonder what those load times would look like following an EXPORTTOAUTOCAD (keeping the C3D drawings for future changes + subsequent EXPORTTOAUTOCAD)..? :evil:
you like your drawings big and bloated, don'tcha?
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2016, 05:31:25 PM »
I did export some of my 2D base files that are xrefd in and the time difference is about 10 seconds. I think by doing that, it stripped all the styles etc. out. But still it did speed it up somewhat.
Civil3D 2020

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2016, 05:48:34 PM »
I did export some of my 2D base files that are xrefd in and the time difference is about 10 seconds. I think by doing that, it stripped all the styles etc. out. But still it did speed it up somewhat.
that's just great, so the solution is to not use civil 3d...awesome!   :2funny: :2funny: :2funny:
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2016, 05:50:37 PM »
Lol. No faster machines and networks!!! That might be the issue. I wonder what types of setups they use to test there software out besides us testing it for them...
Civil3D 2020

rkmcswain

  • Swamp Rat
  • Posts: 978
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2016, 07:33:29 AM »
If it's a one time thing, you could move the parent drawing to a different drive or location so that the Xrefs cannot be found.
If they are saved with a full path, using drive letters, you could disconnect the drive letter.
In other words, temporarily make it where AutoCAD cannot find the xrefs.


MSTG007

  • Gator
  • Posts: 2601
  • I can't remeber what I already asked! I need help!
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2016, 07:36:04 AM »
Again, that was my thought if there is some sort of reactor or routine once the file is opening it would could unload the xrefs as its loading the rest of the drawings.
Civil3D 2020

Rob...

  • King Gator
  • Posts: 3824
  • Take a little time to stop and smell the roses.
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2016, 07:50:54 AM »
Wouldn't the XREFs need to be loaded in order to get unloaded? Sounds like it might actually take longer.

I think you would need to unload them at save.

Again, no matter what you do it's gonna be a headache for someone. What would you do at printing time? I would hate to have to reload every XREF every time I printed. I guess it would not be a big deal if it were only a sheet or two, but when I print it is hardly ever just a couple sheets.
CAD Tech

mjfarrell

  • Seagull
  • Posts: 14444
  • Every Student their own Lesson
Re: Xref - Loading Startup
« Reply #27 on: March 24, 2016, 12:28:53 PM »
This is one of those areas that has a knock on effect of MAP not working with Civil Objects.
Otherwise one would not need to deal with this issue.

Attach file as source, query in only what you wanted to work on, and be done with it.


However one can't do this, because MAP and C3D simply do not play together, even though they are
living inside each other as it were.
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/