Topic: PDF causes a loss of performance

[Hangman]

Has anyone run into a problem importing a PDF file into an empty template and have the drawing turn really sluggish?

I have an 8mg scanned PDF (from a bldg. drawn 65 years ago, i.e.: board drafting) I xref'd into an empty drawing template and immediately the drawing becomes sluggish.  Especially around the zoom (mouse wheel).  I can turn the layer the xref is attached to off and I get immediate performance gains so it's obviously in the PDF.

I'm looking for a system variable I can adjust or something I can change in ACAD to help with this performance loss as I can't edit / manipulate the PDF.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you,  Hangman.

[Rob...]

This is a known issue. It should help if you change to a different type of image format, PNG or TIFF should help.

[JohnK]

Or DWFx. I have been using DWFs more and more over the last few years and I really like them. ...The XPS format Microsoft came up with is really nice. A lot of potential.

[cadtag]

Or DWFx. I have been using DWFs more and more over the last few years and I really like them. ...The XPS format Microsoft came up with is really nice. A lot of potential.

a DWFx from a scan?  Given the OPs description, I'd go with converting the scanned PDF to either a bitonal TIFF, or a PNG.

[JohnK]

Or DWFx. I have been using DWFs more and more over the last few years and I really like them. ...The XPS format Microsoft came up with is really nice. A lot of potential.

a DWFx from a scan?  Given the OPs description, I'd go with converting the scanned PDF to either a bitonal TIFF, or a PNG.

I was speaking more to the general problem(s) of PDFattach. -i.e. I use DWF whenever possible. But, I'll play along for a while. What do you think is in the PDF? ...DWF, XPS, PDF are containers in this respect. So, when people say "convert a scanned PDF to jpg" they really mean: "extract".

[cadtag]

Oh I completely agree with the better performance in general of DWF vs PDF.  PDFAttach is more of a 'checkbox' feature than as useful as it could be IMHO.   For vector CAD generated files, DWF is great.  PDF incorporates so many mixes, that it's often a mess to work with. 

For the OP though, given that he's dealing with a 65 year old  drawing, (blue-line?  blue-print?  ink on linen?) run through a scanner and saved to PDF, I'd expect a lot of pixels, many irrelevant from the background -- probably colored by yellowing of the media, and faded linework that's hard to work with.  IronGall ink does tend to brown out with age and oxidation.  Dunno about squid ink anymore.  Before my time donchaknow.

Heck the 20 year old bluelines I've had to deal with have been messy enough after scanning. 

[CAB]

Here in ACAD2006 I avoid PDF & Word Files. Performance & hang ups.
I convert Word files to Mtext & PDF to image to use in the DWG.

[danallen]

I've always converted scans to monochrome/bitmap mode TIF files (all black or white) reduces file size dramatically. In photoshop you need to convert RGB to grayscale, then to bitmap mode. Or in Bluebeam you can export the PDF to TIF format and change export preferences to use monochrome option.

Also allows scan to be color of layer inserted on, such as a dark gray to not compete with linework drawn over

[snownut2]

I use PNG for images, no noticable performance issues, and the images always print out clearly.

[ronjonp]

I use PNG for images, no noticable performance issues, and the images always print out clearly.

X2

[Krushert]

I've always converted scans to monochrome/bitmap mode TIF files (all black or white) reduces file size dramatically. In photoshop you need to convert RGB to grayscale, then to bitmap mode. Or in Bluebeam you can export the PDF to TIF format and change export preferences to use monochrome option.

Also allows scan to be color of layer inserted on, such as a dark gray to not compete with linework drawn over

Adobe Pro will save to TIFF, PNG and JPEG formats. 

[danallen]

My experience is PNG is good for converting a vector based PDF to image, as PNG format is optimized for this. Raster scans generally have smaller file size in JPG format if color, and I still like TIF for monochrome. If I recall correctly monochrome TIF can be transparent, PNG can't.

I use PNG for images, no noticable performance issues, and the images always print out clearly.

[Crank]

My experience is PNG is good for converting a vector based PDF to image, as PNG format is optimized for this. Raster scans generally have smaller file size in JPG format if color, and I still like TIF for monochrome. If I recall correctly monochrome TIF can be transparent, PNG can't.

[...]

A vector based PDF can be converted to dxf.

[snownut2]

I use this for doing my file conversion, you can create bookmarked pdf files containing many different original file types in one operation, also comes with a handy tool "Acroplot Matrix" that allows marking up of PDF files (filling in forms marking drawings etc.)

Also converts PDF's into many different image file types.

https://www.cadzation.com/acroplotpro_info.htm

And @ $199.00 its less than 1/2 the price of Acrobat.

[Rob...]

But AutoCAD still takes a performance hit with PDFs created from it.

[Hangman]

Well Thank you for all the replies & the discussion of PDF vs a raster image file.
From the sounds of it, a Monochrome TIFF raster file is a better bet than PNG but isn't a JPEG compressed more?  So if one has an 8mg PDF converting over to a TIFF file vs JPEG file, ...  well I think it would depend on the one doing the conversion, how well they know the software (Acrobat, Bluebeam, Acroplot Pro, etc), how well the software converts the file & the compression, etc.

I agree with the DWF(x) completely, I use to work with them all the time, back when the DWF viewer from Autodesk was 1.2 meg in size. You could copy the .exe file to a 3.5" floppy disk & send it with your drawings to a client.  I was a big promoter of DWF's, but for some reason nobody else liked them so we quit using them.

[JohnK]

Well Thank you for all the replies & the discussion of PDF vs a raster image file.
From the sounds of it, a Monochrome TIFF raster file is a better bet than PNG but isn't a JPEG compressed more?  So if one has an 8mg PDF converting over to a TIFF file vs JPEG file, ...  well I think it would depend on the one doing the conversion, how well they know the software (Acrobat, Bluebeam, Acroplot Pro, etc), how well the software converts the file & the compression, etc.

I agree with the DWF(x) completely, I use to work with them all the time, back when the DWF viewer from Autodesk was 1.2 meg in size. You could copy the .exe file to a 3.5" floppy disk & send it with your drawings to a client.  I was a big promoter of DWF's, but for some reason nobody else liked them so we quit using them.

TIFF is uncompressed. JPG has a nice compression.
Question: The OP said SCANed PDFs...why even scan to a PDF if you can scan to an image (save the step of "EXTRACTING" the image).

For what its worth:
DWFx uses the XPS format Microsoft developed.

• XPS still doesn't handle 3d files yet.
• DWF viewer cant read raw XPS files yet.
• The built in XPS viewer sucks. --Use Sumatra viewer for a really nice alt.
• XPS files can be viewed in internet explorer.

[cadtag]

Well Thank you for all the replies & the discussion of PDF vs a raster image file.
From the sounds of it, a Monochrome TIFF raster file is a better bet than PNG but isn't a JPEG compressed more?  ...

JPEG (Joint Photographic Experts Group) is optimized for photos.  Monochrome (bi-tonal) is not well served quality or otherwise with a compression scheme that's intended for color photography utilizing millions of colours.  For one thing, it cannot do monochrome.  JPEG can do grayscale, but that's not the same thing at all.

Unless of course you want to print the sepia yellowed paper and blueline colors of the old original....

I'm not sure offhand if a PNG can do monochrome (bitonal) images, of if it would resort to grayscale.  And if you want a transparent background in CAD and only see the lines, then bitonal is the only route to take.

[cadtag]

...
TIFF is uncompressed. JPG has a nice compression.
...

TIFF can be used as a compressed format.  LZW or ZIP compression are both incorporated in the format definition.

[JohnK]

...
LZW or ZIP compression are both incorporated in the format definition.

It is? ...huh. Good to know.

[Hangman]

...
TIFF is uncompressed. JPG has a nice compression.
Question: The OP said SCANed PDFs...why even scan to a PDF if you can scan to an image (save the step of "EXTRACTING" the image).
 ...

Good question; I would think they (the scanners/receptionist in the office) were instructed to preserve the old drawings in PDF (or perhaps that's all the scanner will do is PDF's or perhaps that's all the receptionist knows how to do).  The drawings were literally 30x48 sheets (Yes, you read that right, 30x48 not 30x42) from, like the 1950's era to my understanding.  I don't know when the sheets were scanned, but they did a pretty good job cleaning it up from the fade of the originals.

But now that I know what you know, I'll be sure to use a TIFF or DWF next round.  Thank you all again.

[ChrisCarlson]

2015 has a noticeable improvement in PDF however it's still far from perfect. In talking to AutoDesk the issue is in the way the PDF is encoded, notably information for snaps. Converting to TIFF is fine and dandy but you lose this ability. However TIFF's are a pain to just view and share via email. My suggestion is scan to PDF, keep the original and create an xref folder containing the TIFF image.

Also try "imaegequality" - "draft" setting within AutoCAD before abandoning PDF's

[cadtag]

Converting a vector PDF to TIFF will lose snapping - converting a PDF scan of a 65 year old blueline drawing to TIFF won't -- you can't lose what's not there.

[Hangman]

Converting a vector PDF to TIFF will lose snapping - converting a PDF scan of a 65 year old blueline drawing to TIFF won't -- you can't lose what's not there.

Very true indeed!