Author Topic: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine  (Read 16478 times)

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mjfarrell

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #15 on: June 17, 2014, 10:55:09 PM »
But then they worked GREAT up until 2010 (last version I used) and made a really nice surface. Just set them to where they don't run out 10 or 20 feet and they work very well with reasonable settings.
Just one more reason I like my new stuff better. Get to fudging variables and you lose accuracy. I hate that "simplify surface" junk these programs have. That leads to a really bogus surface. Use the shots taken in the field only. Start "adjusting" things too much and you may find yourself in a witness box trying to explain the feature to a jury of "their" peers. Think about explaining the new AutoCAD to a jury of people that don't have a clue what a contour is, much less a tin.
(And, oh, it was my AutoCAD VAR that told me that he had NEVER heard of proximity faults and that the ONLY way to get valid breaklines was to trace over all of your line work with a 3D poly. Point to point. Another reason why I switched software.)

Your VAR was (is) and idiot
However as I said IF there is a feature that warrants a breakline then your surveyor should shoo the points that define that feature.

You must understand that now as with previous versions the elevations assigned to that break line is the one 'proximal' to the vertex, and we both know that is not the actual elevation.

Close only counts in hand grenades, howitzers, and nuclear weapons, not surveying.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 10:58:39 PM by mjfarrell »
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MSTG007

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #16 on: June 18, 2014, 07:39:06 AM »
I gotta ask this question. Still spins off this topic. Feature Lines and Grading Criterias. Is it better to use one overall feature line that you grade your criterias from or do you break the feature line then grade that segment or segments? For an example, You have an overall feature line that is connected. It goes from the sidewalk (finished pavement) all around the lot and includes the entrances. Do you break the feature line at the entrances or do you not?
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mjfarrell

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #17 on: June 18, 2014, 08:35:07 AM »
NO

NO


NO

You apply different grading criteria, along it at appropriate locations.


Please, don't tell me you have been breaking them up into little segments....

No, really don't tell me
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MSTG007

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #18 on: June 18, 2014, 08:46:36 AM »
Most do... don't know why...
To be honest. I do / do alittle of both.
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mjfarrell

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #19 on: June 18, 2014, 09:06:09 AM »
 :-o


I said don't tell me.....now my head hurts   :-P     :|      :roll:     :-D
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Mark

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #20 on: June 18, 2014, 10:10:50 AM »
I'm really glad i only work with small 3D projects.
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MSTG007

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #21 on: June 18, 2014, 10:24:54 AM »
Mark, How do you usually do it?
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Mark

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #22 on: June 18, 2014, 10:35:40 AM »
Mark, How do you usually do it?
I use 3D polylines for everything. When i create my surface I do a Select All and make them all breaklines. The slowest part is working around arcs. I create points along the arc that are close enough to each other so that the surface looks good but represents the actual ground surface.
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mjfarrell

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #23 on: June 18, 2014, 10:49:24 AM »
Mark, How do you usually do it?
I use 3D polylines for everything. When i create my surface I do a Select All and make them all breaklines. The slowest part is working around arcs. I create points along the arc that are close enough to each other so that the surface looks good but represents the actual ground surface.

Feature Lines.....PLEASE

Supplemental factors PLEASE  - you are doing it wrong.

Now my head really hurts. 
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MSTG007

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #24 on: June 18, 2014, 11:06:41 AM »
Hey, you heard it from the Boss man.

Maybe we need a sticky on the way feature lines are supposed to be use (ideally)? Just a thought... Like you said. Name your Breaklines / Create one overall featureline use grading criterias from that...

Just a thought
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Mark

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #25 on: June 18, 2014, 11:18:01 AM »
Supplemental factors PLEASE  - you are doing it wrong.
when i have time i'll argue with you. but your method makes my head hurt.
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Dent Cermak

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #26 on: June 18, 2014, 01:28:58 PM »
But then they worked GREAT up until 2010 (last version I used) and made a really nice surface. Just set them to where they don't run out 10 or 20 feet and they work very well with reasonable settings.
Just one more reason I like my new stuff better. Get to fudging variables and you lose accuracy. I hate that "simplify surface" junk these programs have. That leads to a really bogus surface. Use the shots taken in the field only. Start "adjusting" things too much and you may find yourself in a witness box trying to explain the feature to a jury of "their" peers. Think about explaining the new AutoCAD to a jury of people that don't have a clue what a contour is, much less a tin.
(And, oh, it was my AutoCAD VAR that told me that he had NEVER heard of proximity faults and that the ONLY way to get valid breaklines was to trace over all of your line work with a 3D poly. Point to point. Another reason why I switched software.)

Your VAR was (is) and idiot
However as I said IF there is a feature that warrants a breakline then your surveyor should shoo the points that define that feature.

You must understand that now as with previous versions the elevations assigned to that break line is the one 'proximal' to the vertex, and we both know that is not the actual elevation.

Close only counts in hand grenades, howitzers, and nuclear weapons, not surveying.

Like I said, in the early days it was the fastest and easiest fix for an inherent problem. It gave data that meet survey accuracy and Nation Map Accuracy standards. All was well within 0.05'.
BUT with the new software we now use this is a moot issue. ALL points are as shot and the 3D and 2D are drawn the same at one time with absolutely no need for "supplemental data" or "Weeding". In the hands of 95% of the people trying to do contours today, those 2 factors are tools of destruction and latent inaccuracies. Dang, most people don't even know all of  the types of contours (Major and Minor - they do not exist in the mapping world. They are a Fig Newton of the imagination of the idiots at Autodesk.) much less what to do with depression contours and their symbolization.(Strange that other software packages allow you to identify and symbolize them automatically?) Anyone else know what a "carrying contour" is. Probably not.
And now I read where Autodesk is backing off the Google tie-in and KMZ files? More and more clients are demanding photo image insertion and Google kmz files and Autodesk is doing a two-step away from that trend?? Well, you get what you pay for. Sometimes.

Mark

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #27 on: June 18, 2014, 02:00:00 PM »
Feature Lines.....PLEASE
I still like my 3D poly's but thanks, i did learn something from this experiment. :D

Question: when creating feature line and you select a point why does it ask for elevation? the point has an elevation. *shrug*
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mjfarrell

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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #28 on: June 18, 2014, 06:49:38 PM »
it is giving you an option to 'override'  that elevation, it that is the right thing to do

also I would ask are your point being inserted @ 0, or actual elevation? 

In the 0 instance that point has an elevation in the label only.

You would grow to love feature lines IF you used them more.

They have more powerful design functionality than your semi-literate 3d polylines   :evil:
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Michael Farrell
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Re: Civil3D - Re-Adding feature lines with Tighter Tine
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2014, 07:33:48 AM »
Another reason why I switched software.)

What software are you now using? We've also switched away from Civil 3d to an Australian program called 12d (http://www.12d.com/). It is light years ahead of Civil 3D in terms of design capability (although less so in drafting as it is more of a design package, then export to AutoCad for drafting) and perhaps best of all, is incredibly stable.