Author Topic: How about breaking an alignment-pipenetwork into 3 pieces added Align Fig.  (Read 1394 times)

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doggarncity

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Hi all
   We just got a task of having to take a proposed pipe network we have entered and having to break it into 3 piecies because it needed to add some drainage structures to a bend in the alignment. See Fig. I proposed to break the alignment and pipe network, but don't know if we have to reenter all the data for each leg... Still new to all the Civil3D but this is something I would rather ask if it can be done or just do another run for each new alignment leg.  I'm adding the fig. to show my problem and what happened.

Thanks
Mike
« Last Edit: December 02, 2008, 04:50:18 PM by doggarncity »

Dinosaur

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Re: How about breaking an alignment-pipenetwork into 3 pieces added Align Fig.
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2008, 06:30:43 PM »
You should be able to do any of your modifications without adding any new pipe network.  I changed pipes and structure to different alignments all of the time without issue keeping it all on the same pipe network.
The news is not all good though.  There is a serious flaw in Civil 3d calculating pipe lengths ans slopes when you are using rectangular structures and especially if you are using these calculated numbers for your drainage calcs.  Civil 3D resists using wall to wall design methods and even though there are ways to force things to look correct, the numbers between structures is always off depending on the slopes and deflections off perpendicular of the pipe runs.  Even an absolute 90 degree deflection at minimum slope will yield a pipe length 0.01 high.  I also believe all crossing calculations are based upon the assumption the pipe runs from center/structure to center/structure and the cheats necessary to get good lengths and slopes will bust the crossing calcs.  If you are able to design to structure centers most of these problems will not be an issue but if you must do wall to wall design, I suggest a field trip to the ship yards to expand your vocabulary of expletives.

mjfarrell

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Re: How about breaking an alignment-pipenetwork into 3 pieces added Align Fig.
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2008, 06:31:28 PM »
Just pull up the create pipe network by layout tools, and insert a structure and the pipe will automatically segment itself where the structure was inserted. Then you can delete the structure later and STILL have your segments.

If I understand your question. :wink:
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/

doggarncity

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Re: How about breaking an alignment-pipenetwork into 3 pieces added Align Fig.
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2008, 08:15:53 AM »
You should be able to do any of your modifications without adding any new pipe network.  I changed pipes and structure to different alignments all of the time without issue keeping it all on the same pipe network.
The news is not all good though.  There is a serious flaw in Civil 3d calculating pipe lengths ans slopes when you are using rectangular structures and especially if you are using these calculated numbers for your drainage calcs.  Civil 3D resists using wall to wall design methods and even though there are ways to force things to look correct, the numbers between structures is always off depending on the slopes and deflections off perpendicular of the pipe runs.  Even an absolute 90 degree deflection at minimum slope will yield a pipe length 0.01 high.  I also believe all crossing calculations are based upon the assumption the pipe runs from center/structure to center/structure and the cheats necessary to get good lengths and slopes will bust the crossing calcs.  If you are able to design to structure centers most of these problems will not be an issue but if you must do wall to wall design, I suggest a field trip to the ship yards to expand your vocabulary of expletives.

Thanks Dino/Mike
    We are changing our template style to do center to center. My other point that I needed cleared up was the association with the alignment to the pipenetwork. I believe I understand better now how they are tied together. My engineer I work with on this project failed to mention that the other parts to the pipenetwork and profiles for the FES structures where in a part of the dwg that I didn't know existed thus my confustion in my layout of (where the heck is the rest of this because it isn't in my profile). So, a communication gap but the benefit is that I learned more about pipe network here.

Mike
I can't tell you how important this forum is to my career, and to that end many thanks to all those that share here. It does make a difference.

mjfarrell

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Re: How about breaking an alignment-pipenetwork into 3 pieces added Align Fig.
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2008, 08:28:18 AM »
One might also like to consider that the network can be relative to an alignment, or it can be independant of an alignment.
Be your Best


Michael Farrell
http://primeservicesglobal.com/