Topic: QLeader Text & Arrow Size?

[craigr]

For our Security type jobs, we use a floor plan copied into our title block in mspace.

Once I get it cleanded of everything but room numbers, walls, doors, etc., I lock those layers and put our security devices where they are to be installed.

After I get the devices placed, I use Quick Leaders, (Framed Text), to document the device & address. I always do the QLeader in MSpace along with the floor plans.

Is there an easy way to figure out what size the text needs to be so that it will appear to be the same size as our 'standard' of .1 while in PSpace?

The way I do it now is to guess at the height and type 'TEST', then switch to PSpace and hover a rectangle that is the same size of PSpace text size .1.

I then go back and forth until I get the MSpace text the proper size. - Kind of a pain.

Is there an easier way?

I REALLY don't want to do the leaders & text in PSpace, and left with no other option, will keep doing it the way I am doing it now.

craigr

[Kate M]

Figure out what scale you'll be plotting to, and do the math.

i.e. 1/8" = 1'-0" --> scale factor = 96 --> 0.1 * 96 = 9.6 text height.

Many people use dimension styles with those kinds of scale factors built in, to cut down on the arithmetic.

[craigr]

But the problem is that some buildings are for example 200' feet long & others may be 100' long.

Wouldn't I have to do this to every dwg?

craigr

[Kate M]

Yep.

How do you plot? Fit to page, or to scale?

If it's "to scale", then you should have a small number of scales that you need text heights for. If it's "fit to page", then there are bigger problems...

[craigr]

We always print to 11x17 at our standard printing coordinates - 15.8233,10.1435 by -.6,-.2232.

craigr

[Kate M]

So your titleblock is 11x17 units, and you scale the building to fit inside it? You always print "full size"?

Sounds like you could always use the same text height, unless I'm missing something...maybe there's a sample file you can post?

[Josh Nieman]

look at the CHANGESPACE command "chspace"

Just do your work in paperspace, over a viewport, then use 'change space' to put that stuff it model space.... it automatically scales it appropriately to the viewport, so make sure the vport is at the right scale for plotting first.

[craigr]

Yes our title block is 11x17ish, but the floorplans are pasted into MSpace, so if left alone, the text prints different sizes depending on the size of the floorplan.

craigr

[craigr]

look at the CHANGESPACE command "chspace"

Arg!!!

It appears that CHSpace is not a command in LT.

But that sounds exactly like what I am looking for.

craigr

[Kate M]

Yes our title block is 11x17ish, but the floorplans are pasted into MSpace, so if left alone, the text prints different sizes depending on the size of the floorplan.

craigr

I don't get it...your text prints differently, or theirs? If your titleblock is always the same size, you should always be able to use the same size text. Are you "pasting as block" and then scaling, then adding text?

It appears that CHSpace is not a command in LT.

Included in LT 2007...

[craigr]

All of the text in my PSpace Title Block is .1 and prints / views the way I want it.

When I paste a floorplan into MSpace, then do my QLeaders - in MSpace, I need the text to appear the same size, when printed, as the text that is in PSpace.

craigr

[Josh Nieman]

It appears that CHSpace is not a command in LT.

Included in LT 2007...

ah... that explains it.  I was stumped for a minute, because I had just showed that command to the electrical guys we work with when they were complaining about having to copy my text from paperspace into modelspace and scaling it.  They acted as I had just signed over a property laden with gold to them, when I taught them that command.  They had 2007 at the time, though.

[Josh Nieman]

All of the text in my PSpace Title Block is .1 and prints / views the way I want it.

When I paste a floorplan into MSpace, then do my QLeaders - in MSpace, I need the text to appear the same size, when printed, as the text that is in PSpace.

craigr

What scale are you printing that floor plan to?

[craigr]

I always print from PSpace which is 1:1.

craigr

[PHX cadie]

Not sure for LT, but under dimstyle, "Fit" tab there may be a button that is "Scale dimensions to layout (paperspace)". If I remember right, (I've been dim'ing in PS for years now) it will auto scale the dims as though they are in PS with all the defaults.

Maybe?

[PHX cadie]

or dimscale.....(x24 for 1/2=1', 48 for 1/4"=1')   ?

No I'm not trying to get a post count up, I just think slow   

[Josh Nieman]

I always print from PSpace which is 1:1.

craigr

Then what scale is the viewport that your floor plan is at?  You need to use that scale as PHX cadie said, to get the size of your text.

If your viewport is set at 1/8"=1'-0" then you would take (.125 / 12 = 96)  So if something is one inch tall (plotted) you would draw it 96 inches tall in model space, for it to appear 1" tall when plotted.  So if something needs to be .1", then you take 96x0.1 = 9.6"  Thus your text size for a floor plan printed at 1/8"=1'-0" would be 9.6" tall.

[PHX cadie]

Is there an easier way?

I hope the scale to layout is there, no math, will be the same w/ vp of dif scales, same page. You can save the dimstyle and use it for all your dwgs.

Fingers crossed

<sp>

[craigr]

I always print from PSpace which is 1:1.

craigr

Then what scale is the viewport that your floor plan is at?  You need to use that scale as PHX cadie said, to get the size of your text.

If your viewport is set at 1/8"=1'-0" then you would take (.125 / 12 = 96)  So if something is one inch tall (plotted) you would draw it 96 inches tall in model space, for it to appear 1" tall when plotted.  So if something needs to be .1", then you take 96x0.1 = 9.6"  Thus your text size for a floor plan printed at 1/8"=1'-0" would be 9.6" tall.

Huh??

That is WAYYY over my head, I think.

Since I dont' draw any of these floorplans, I don't have a clue about any of that. I thought everything was 1:1 in MSpace, Doors are typically 36" drawn so they are actually 36" doors. If a bldg's hallway is 50' long, then it is in real life, - right?

To create our viewports I always just do the 'view/viewport/new viewport then click where & size I want.

craigr

[Josh Nieman]

I always print from PSpace which is 1:1.

craigr

Then what scale is the viewport that your floor plan is at?  You need to use that scale as PHX cadie said, to get the size of your text.

If your viewport is set at 1/8"=1'-0" then you would take (.125 / 12 = 96)  So if something is one inch tall (plotted) you would draw it 96 inches tall in model space, for it to appear 1" tall when plotted.  So if something needs to be .1", then you take 96x0.1 = 9.6"  Thus your text size for a floor plan printed at 1/8"=1'-0" would be 9.6" tall.

Huh??

That is WAYYY over my head, I think.

Since I dont' draw any of these floorplans, I don't have a clue about any of that. I thought everything was 1:1 in MSpace, Doors are typically 36" drawn so they are actually 36" doors. If a bldg's hallway is 50' long, then it is in real life, - right?

To create our viewports I always just do the 'view/viewport/new viewport then click where & size I want.

craigr

Yea, everything is DRAWN one to one... but your viewport is set to a scale right?  Like... in the properties of the viewport or on the viewports toolbar, you set the viewport at a proper scale, right?

[craigr]

Standard Scale = Custom
Custom scale = 0"

Is that what you mean?

craigr

[Josh Nieman]

Standard Scale = Custom
Custom scale = 0"

Is that what you mean?

craigr

You don't set your viewports to a scale?  When you create the viewport, it sizes what is in model space by a certain amount to fit in on the layout.  That amount it is scaled should be a standard scale ( 1/2"=1'-0", 1/8"=1'-0" etc)

You don't use standard scales?  If not... then this will be ultimately more difficult.

[craigr]

Apparently we do not scale our viewports - sorry, I never learned any of this.

What is the purpose?

I guess I could see it if you needed to know the size of a bldg from a printed copy, but for our purposes, we have never seen the need.

BTW, I appreciate all of this help and patience. As I said, I know very little about this part.

craigr

[PHX cadie]

Did you have a scale to layout options under dimstyle.

That will work even if the vp is not a standard scale.

[Josh Nieman]

The benefit of scaling drawings to standard scales is just as you said, being able to scale off sheets.  Technically you shouldn't be scaling off drawings in the field (bad practice) but it's mostly because all legal agencies that structural/architectural would submit plans to for approval (Fire Marshall, City Boards, Parish/County Officials where applicable) require that drawings be to a certain scale.

[craigr]

I see that, but not sure how it works.

Once I select it, shouldn't it automatically change my text size under the 'text' tab? It doesn't.

craigr

[PHX cadie]

I see that, but not sure how it works.

Once I select it, shouldn't it automatically change my text size under the 'text' tab? It doesn't.

craigr

Me or Josh? 

If me, is the text height under text format=0, the under dim text he height you want (.1). If you checked that option, you may need to update existing dims, but new should be ok

What is does is scale all the dim values to the viewport, 24 for 1/2 =1', x48 for 1/4=1'. Takes the text ht of (.1) x 48, dimgap x48, extention lines x48 etc, basically all the dim values times the viewport.
Back to work 

[craigr]

I will play with these over the w/e.

Thanks again for all of the help.

craigr

[PHX cadie]

waiting for Craig to post back....man, its only Sunday.......hope I don't sound like a pushy car salesman, but I think this scale to ps is his ticket.

some things I didn't touch on too well:  (had to be quick at work)

I spent some very frustrating days with the text size, (hope you didn't) till I found out the text height, under format text style should be 0. Guess that setting frees it up for other variables (?).  The text height in the dimension settings should be the ht you want (.1) and the box next to scale to ps under the fit tab checked.
 I dim'd in model for several years w/o any problems and everything looked the same no matter the viewport, one dimstyle for everything, (except dif units)the Navy didn't exactly sub dwgs or share files, so there were no concerns of a "clean" model, or any other augments of ms vs ps.

Sunday......(wonder what time Craig goes to work). Maybe I should call.....4 seconds, 3 minutes after 2 AM today, it will be 020304050607, I'm sure he'll be awake for that....

[Bryco]

A very easy solution to this is to create a block that is a rectangle sized to the printable area of 11x17.
For me it is 16.25X10.5.
If you have a title block, subtract the area used by the titleblock from the rectangle.
If the rectangle is on layer defpoints it wont print (I leave the blocks in the drawing).
Put a line in this block .1" high (your textheight).
Now we have a rectangle in modelspace that represents the usable drawing area using a paperspace viewport scale of 1:1.
Although you are printing 1:1 and modelspace is drawn 1:1, the viewports are still scaling their view of modelspace.
The viewport is acting like a wide angle lens and scaling the view of modelspace down.
If you are printing with your viewport scaled  at 1 to 96 or 1/8"=1'-0" (12/.125=96), scale that block by 96, you now have the a rectangle representing the usable drawing area using a paperspace viewport scale of 1/8"=1'-0"
The line in the block is scaled to the height of your text also.
Now if you don't print to scale that is you zoom in the viewport till it looks good, then your modelspace text height is the scale of that viewport/.1.
The same thing can be accomplished by positiong and scaling your rectangle block to cover the area you want printed in modelspace. Now the text height is still the height of the line in the block.
Now to get that rectangle  just right in your paperspace viewport, click inside the viewport, type z to get into the zoom command, type w to use the window method then type End and snap to the lower left corner of the rectangle then End  again and select the opposite corner.
If your viewport is sized correctly the rectangle will be the size of your viewport.
craigr I've written this out in simple steps as I don't have Lt and I don't know what will and won't work in Lt.

[craigr]

some things I didn't touch on too well:  (had to be quick at work)

I spent some very frustrating days with the text size, (hope you didn't) till I found out the text height, under format text style should be 0. Guess that setting frees it up for other variables (?).  The text height in the dimension settings should be the ht you want (.1) and the box next to scale to ps under the fit tab checked...

Holy Cow!!!

THAT's the ticket!

It works great and is sooo easy.

I am humbled by alot of the responses, (WAY over my head). You folks make them sound sooo easy, but I still haven't grasped the concept.

Thanks for all of the responses,
craigr

[Kate M]

Lost in Paperspace 1
Lost in Paperspace 2

[craigr]

Now that I am well into my settings to make these into a macro / icon,

Without the Dimstyle dialog box, how do I tell it to 'draw a frame around the text' - what you 'check box' in the dialog box?

Next quesiton - How do I get to the settings of 'QLeader' without the dialog box coming up? The -qleader doesn't work.

I thought I have run into this before, but cannot it isn't in my 'Tip's' file that I keep. I did a search on the swamp and found only the ' - ' option.

craigr

[PHX cadie]

Now that I am well into my settings to make these into a macro / icon,

Without the Dimstyle dialog box, how do I tell it to 'draw a frame around the text' - what you 'check box' in the dialog box?

craigr

Wait a minute w or w/o the dialog box? 

w/o, found this:

"To create a box around the text, set the DIMGAP system variable to a negative value. The offset between the box and the text is the absolute value of DIMGAP"

That's weird,  I remember spending 2 weeks looking for what they called the space between the object and the extention line, but to draw a frame around the text   . 
It works.

With dialog box, I'd check the "Draw frame around text" under the text tab.

Will look for the qleader one

[craigr]

That did it!

I always wondered why the 'Offset from Dim line' was at a negative number sometimes.

Thanks and keep em comiing, I am still looking on my own also.

craigr

[PHX cadie]

How do I get to the settings of 'QLeader' without the dialog box coming up? The -qleader doesn't work.

Sorry I'm not having any luck today.

[craigr]

I found in the Help file that all of the settings can be done without dialog boxes, but I haven't been able to find the commands either.

Oh well, thanks again for all of your help,

craigr

[PHX cadie]

I found in the Help file that all of the settings can be done without dialog boxes, but I haven't been able to find the commands either.

How did you find it under Help? A certain keyword or topic?

Guess it would have smart of me to ask if there where any settings in particular you are looking for from the very beginning. 
I had it in my mind a certain command in the command line, then a settings option, all in the command line. 

I'll check my book (its at work), but I believe there is an entire section on the dimxxx commands.

What leader settings are you looking for?

Anyway good luck!

[craigr]

I don't remember where in the help file, I was searching for QLeader, settings, Suppress dialog box, etc....

The settings I change in the 'Leader Setttings' dialog box are -

Annotation tab: uncheck the 'Prompt for width', check 'Always left Justify', and check 'Frame Text'.
Leader Line & Arrow tab: Straight Leader Line, check the 'No Limit' for Number of Points,
The Attachment tab: Select 'Middle of Multi-line text' for both the text on the right side and on the left side.

I have some of these built into a template, but would like an icon for those instances when we don't start with that particular template.

This is a real dome scratcher. I have looked in the 'AutoCad Bible', but haven't found it yet.

craigr