TheSwamp
Code Red => VB(A) => Topic started by: TimSpangler on September 05, 2006, 12:32:53 PM
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Wasn't there supposed to be a little class starting soon?
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yes, and when I asked, nobody spoke up. I can start the class whenever you are ready. I just need a few things from you, like level of experience, what do you want to do with VBA, do you know LISP, etc. All of that just helps me guide you towards your goal. The LISP reference is so I can make comparisons you understand
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I thought so. I didn't see a post about replying. SOrry 'bout that. I have pretty much no experiance with VBA just try to piddle around here and there. As far as what I want to do I would like to start writing applications or porting some of my lisp stuff over. I do know lisp. I'll be here just tell me when and how. :lol:
Thanks
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Count me in....
I've got experience with LSP, VBA and VB (more commfy working with VBA than LSP).
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Count me in also....
I have become fairly familiar with vlisp and vba but realize that there is much to learn about both.
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Love to. but absolutely can not start anything until after the week of 9/12 --I am still in beginner land- hopefully when things start to calm down after convention (800 people comming from all over the world) I can actually get some learning in..... :-)
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Do you have room for an absolute rookie who's programming credits are limited to the modifying of existing r10 vintage autolisp?
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dino, it is a very simple language, the hard part is getting started. I think you'll love it
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Well THAT is encouraging. It appears VB(A) is the preferred method for wrenching new reports and other functions with Civil 3D.
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[*soft voice*]
Is anyone able to confirm that VBA Support will be continued for ACAD ?
Has anyone heard any information as to the suitability of VBA for 64bit applications ?
[*sneaks away*]
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I would like to be involved too.
I only know some very basic VB. I have been writing my own code for almost 2 years.
I started with sendcommand and moved from there. :) I can be creative with ACAD at times and using sendcommand was just a way to automate what I could already do.
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That's all great, but I'd take what Kerry is saying and not stop with vba or lisp. .net might be the way to go from there.
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[*soft voice*]
Is anyone able to confirm that VBA Support will be continued for ACAD ?
Has anyone heard any information as to the suitability of VBA for 64bit applications ?
[*sneaks away*]
I can not confirm or deny any support in the future. Looking back at what we have "heard" for years about LISP support, and legacy code, I would say that VBA will be supported for at least the next 2 releases. (PURLEY MY OPINION)
That being said, anyone who gets started learning VBA SHOULD be able to switch to a .Net language fairly easily. I started learning C# and found it fairly easy as it related to VBA. VB.Net would be even closer, but I chose C# instead.
I will contact a few friends at Adesk and reseller to see if they know anymore than we speculate though.
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Just for reference on this, Civil 3D is supposedly on Autodesk's bleeding edge. As far as I can tell all of the report customizations and the sub assemblies used to define road cross sections which in turn build surfaces depend on VBA routines.
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I read an interview not long ago with someone from Autodesk and they were asked about that very thing. The answer given (paraphrased) was: "We have no intention of taking them out of AutoCAD because our customers use them and depend on them".
I've heard rumors since ~R14 about LISP eventually being taken out but I've not seen anything come of it. What I have noticed is that Autodesk hasn't added to the functionality of LISP for a long time and I don't see that there will be much of a push to do so. I think that they're going for the "It will eventually die on its own" tact.
What I would love for one (or two) of you gurus to do would be to start a C# class for people who are just starting out and wanting to learn C#. It seems like the majority of the people I talk to (on and off the forum) are heading that way for one reason or another.
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Just for reference on this, Civil 3D is supposedly on Autodesk's bleeding edge. As far as I can tell all of the report customizations and the sub assemblies used to define road cross sections which in turn build surfaces depend on VBA routines.
It might help, reading this:
developer center - autodesk civil 3d
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/index?siteID=123112&id=8007696
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What I would love for one (or two) of you gurus to do would be to start a C# class for people who are just starting out and wanting to learn C#. It seems like the majority of the people I talk to (on and off the forum) are heading that way for one reason or another.
I second that request, as I am not qualified to teach that class.
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What I would love for one (or two) of you gurus to do would be to start a C# class for people who are just starting out and wanting to learn C#. It seems like the majority of the people I talk to (on and off the forum) are heading that way for one reason or another.
I second that request, as I am not qualified to teach that class.
I would like to attend to a class of C#.... depending on where that is going to take place.... :-)
(I have been doing some coding in C# - but pure mickey mouse stuff - still)
Since appears that will be focus for autocad, it will be required to have at minimum autocad 2006 or 2007 ? no? - because of some methods or properties not implemented or wrapped yet - I will say.
Maybe some of the masters in C# could help on a better adviced....
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Anyone who thinks that Autodesk will remove VBA from AutoCAD or it's verticals is insane. With the amount of business logic that it's customers have built using VBA removing it would mean a lot of extremely irritated customers. Once you add something to a product and people code against it you really can't remove it.
That's why in COM objects you see a lot of things such as "DataStore", "DataStore2" and "DataStore3". DataStore3 is the most recent but since people have coded against DataStore and DataStore2 and put it in production they can't remove that functionality.
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Just for reference on this, Civil 3D is supposedly on Autodesk's bleeding edge. As far as I can tell all of the report customizations and the sub assemblies used to define road cross sections which in turn build surfaces depend on VBA routines.
It might help, reading this:
developer center - autodesk civil 3d
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/index?siteID=123112&id=8007696
In other words... they are using: VB, VBA, C++, C# and VB.NET.
And not exposing any of the extensions to ObjectARX [ :-(]
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While I agree that the continuation of Lisp support has been a point of contention and speculation for the last 10 years, there has been nothing to replace it.
The situation with VBA is different. If I was asked to speculate, I'd just say "have a look at the emerging VSA technology."
Please note that I'm not poopahing the VBA class idea, I do believe that ANY language learnt is an benefit, and a base to build on.
Rather than wait for a C# or VBNet class to start, we may be better served just getting one of the express editions and start bashing keys with several of the myriad of free tutorials available .. and start asking questions when we hit a wall.
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Rather than wait for a C# or VBNet class to start, we may be better served just getting one of the express editions and start bashing keys with several of the myriad of free tutorials available .. and start asking questions when we hit a wall.
This is what I have started doing. Im hoping next week to start creating small routines to do the basics i.e. create a layer, draw a line, xref a dwg in, etc
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Is this class in addition to, or a continuation of the one that was started some time ago?
Either way, I'm in... novice experience level, but I'm wanting to do some things that are not easy (for me, if even possible) with LISP (novice there too. ~well, enough to be dangerous.)
What I want to do:
Take existing gometry, make it jump through hoops, and come out the other end as G-code. ie. automate our now tedious task of copy to a metric template, scale, translate layers, save as r12dxf, save in another directory.... stuff like that.
I'd also like to do a custom proggy that'll automate all my project data management tasks. Create job folders, fill out title blocks, keep track of progress, scheduling, etc. Stuff I do now in excel, and some word docs.
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Is this class in addition to, or a continuation of the one that was started some time ago?
Either way, I'm in... novice experience level, but I'm wanting to do some things that are not easy (for me, if even possible) with LISP (novice there too. ~well, enough to be dangerous.)
What I want to do:
Take existing gometry, make it jump through hoops, and come out the other end as G-code. ie. automate our now tedious task of copy to a metric template, scale, translate layers, save as r12dxf, save in another directory.... stuff like that.
I'd also like to do a custom proggy that'll automate all my project data management tasks. Create job folders, fill out title blocks, keep track of progress, scheduling, etc. Stuff I do now in excel, and some word docs.
In other words, Birdy wants to go to work, press and few buttons and walla, have his work done and take home his 8hrs of pay :-D But, I'm sure we would all like that....
Sorry to hijack the thread... (back to your class discussion)
I's love to join, but I just don't have time... I did sign up to 1 or 2 beginning VBA classes at AU just to get my feet wet...
Pieter
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So when is the class? heh.
BTW, My brother is a MS certified VB.NET instructor. I am so lucky when he actually has a few minutes to help me. He does not know anything about ACAD though. He codes more than he teaches. Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. He said that before becoming a teacher. He was slow and needed the money and my mom was teaching at the time too and talked him into it.
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I don't think vba will go away in the near future, BUT, MS is starting their compain with VSTA (http://blogs.msdn.com/vsta/). While I agree with Tim on the reasons why they won't ditch it they do seem to want to merge the two, sort of how they have people moving to .net for business solutions. IOW, they advise "start using .net, it's the future".
Will Vista 'fully' support vba?? New technologies create turnover for MS and the cycle continues...
Another thing to consider is 64bit computing, will they convert vb/a to 64bit or will they start from scratch and create a decent language instead of hacking an old one to get it to work? Would you want to use a 32bit language when the mainstream will be 64bit?
Having said that, Kerry is correct in saying that any language is worth learning and vb/a will be around long enough to learn how to program so making the transition to another language shouldn't be too hard.
The hardest thing to do with a course like this is how to teach programming AND the AutoCAD api at once, it's very hard to learn an api when you don't know how it works (as part of a program).
But, we all gotta start somewhere, just get in and do it :)
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... Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. ...
I know that expression is commonly quoted, but it contradicts my experience. The axiom that those who teach are incompetent in a practical matters is erroneous and insulting.
No personal acrimony intended Dave.
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..... Another thing to consider is 64bit computing, will they convert vb/a to 64bit or will they start from scratch and create a decent language instead of hacking an old one to get it to work? Would you want to use a 32bit language when the mainstream will be 64bit?
............... But, we all gotta start somewhere, just get in and do it :)
Mick, The 64 bit comment I posted was a little cryptic. You've expressed my concern explicitly.
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In other words, Birdy wants to go to work, press and few buttons and walla, have his work done and take home his 8hrs of pay :-D But, I'm sure we would all like that....
Actually, It'd be more like:
"Lookie here boss!" <pointing right here> "I just did in 5 minutes what used to take me 5 hours." 8-)
"By my ROI cal-kalations, I just saved you $15,000.00+/year!" <Birdy jumps for joy!> :angel:
<somewhat subdude tone> "Boy. I must be worth way more than you're paying me now, dontcha think?" ^-^
<Boss :x>: <smacking Birdy in the head> "Impressive. Now that you have all this free time on your hands, here, do this so I don't have to."
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Actually, It'd be more like:
"Lookie here boss!" <pointing right here> "I just did in 5 minutes what used to take me 5 hours." 8-)
"By my ROI cal-kalations, I just saved you $15,000.00+/year!" <Birdy jumps for joy!> :angel:
<somewhat subdude tone> "Boy. I must be worth way more than you're paying me now, dontcha think?" ^-^
<Boss :x>: <smacking Birdy in the head> "Impressive. Now that you have all this free time on your hands, here, do this so I don't have to."
Been there and done that and well... that's why I don't work for that company anymore
and not because it was my choice. we all learn at some point...
Pieter
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Thanks Kerry, I appreicate that.
I totally agree with you. Hench how I pointed out he now teaches. :)
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Well I am going to start with some simple thing and if I get stuck Yoo guys will be the first to know :-D
See you soon.
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... Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. ...
No personal acrimony intended Dave.
None taken at all, besides, you have taught me more than I have taught so its all good.
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... Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. ...
I know that expression is commonly quoted, but it contradicts my experience. The axiom that those who teach are incompetent in a practical matters is erroneous and insulting.
No personal acrimony intended Dave.
See, I don't look at that quote in the same way. I've always looked at it as a way to explain the passion involved in being really good at any one thing. Take music as an example. It's something that you've got to love to be really good at. If you can make your living playing music, you will. If you can't (for whatever reason) your love for music will compel you to share it, usually by teaching.
I've never looked at it as a measure of incompetence. My music analogy above comes from personal experience. My inability to make music my living has nothing to do with incompetence as much as it has to do with me not wanting or being able to spoil something I love so much by putting a price tag on it. I happen to be quite a well versed musician who can play more instruments than any other person I know. I can write music quite well. I can sing better than average. I can spout off music theory in my sleep. But I refuse to make a living doing it because doing so would cheapen it for me. I spent several years as a music instructor but even that was painful because I wasn't comfortable accepting money for what I was doing. I'll gladly teach someone who is willing to learn, provided they take it seriously, and provided they not pay me. Both of my boys are exposed to a variety of music and musical training (although they don't quite know it) because it's something that I love so much, I cannot NOT teach them to appreciate it as well.
I haven't played music in years because all of my attempts to do so always brought my worst fears to fruition. What started out as a few people getting together to just play music because they enjoyed playing music always managed to turn itself into one or more of those people wanting to go out and make money doing it. And the last couple of bands I've been in were with a relative who I happened to be very close to... and it was him that took those bands in that direction and ruined the experience for me. Every time I try to play music now, it's very painful for me because it brings back so many memories... some good, most bad.
The love and passion for music that I've always had still lives within me and I share it with the people I care about, but I share it in a way I am able to. And that way isn't making a living doing it, it's teaching my children and friends to really appreciate good music and recognise crap when they hear it. :-)
Sorry for the hijack, that saying and the reaction to it struck a nerve I guess. :oops:
Kerry, you happen to be extremely good at what you do. You don't need me to tell you that. If, for some reason you were unable to make your living doing it (for instance, let's say that, as good a programmer as you are, you were an even better chef and being a chef paid the bills) I can't imagine you abandoning something that you've obviously sunk so much of your blood sweat and tears into. I can't imagine you being able to not share your knowledge with everyone, just like you already do. And if that's a measure of incompetence, it's flawed. Seriously flawed.
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Well, I would like to try the class even I get left behind at some point. The trouble is, I can read the threads in the forum, but I can't post anything.