Topic: Project set-up

[jonesy]

Righty then, I'm here to pick everyones brains about cad project lifespan... (Oooh, that sounds good ) - basically project set-up and archiving... specifically related to cad and xrefs.

The IT guys here are setting up a new server and we will be transferring our data soon. We will be able to keep the drive letter as we currently have it (but not the whole pathing structure), but when we archive, the files will be going to a different disk and file structure. When this happens the xrefs lose their paths and if we have to open a file most of the data is missing. I'd thought about using local paths for xrefs, would that stop the problem of missing xrefs when the drive letter changes?

So, I am asking for your opinion on the various method of attaching xrefs, and also, how easy is it to "batch" change the paths from absolute to relative paths if we find that is the best method for us to adopt.

Many thanks in advance.
T

[CADaver]

We use 'eTransmit' to archive the files at project close-out sending the xrefs to the same directory as the target file.  The only real drawback is the duplication of some files across discipline directories.  I make note in the project README.DOC of duplicates.

We've also tried remapping drives for retrieval from archive.  Just copy the entire project folder to archive as is.  Then when you need to retrieve just re-map the archive drive letter/directory.  That seemed hinky to some folks so we opted for eTransmit.

DWGTrueConvert can do the same thing as eTransmit, and it let's you select multiple files in multiple directories and will send them all to one directory.

[New Shooz]

I have always used Relative paths for x-refs and images.
That way, it doesn't matter if the driver letter changes; as long as the directory structure remains the same.
If the directory structure changes, then oh bugger indeed; and etransmit is usually the most efficient method.

[jonesy]

I'm just evedropping on a conversation my boss is having with the IT guy, and it looks like nearly all the directory structure will be changing!
Here they have always used the full path for xrefs, so it looks like this is gonna bite us big time!

I am hopeful that we can keep the existing jobs on the existing structure, but it looks like we might need to change the absolute to relative...

[New Shooz]

Don't eavesdrop on the conversation; go get yourself stuck into it yourself

[jonesy]

Don't eavesdrop on the conversation; go get yourself stuck into it yourself

I can't... it was a phone call. (and all I could hear was my boss's side of the call -  so I might have totally the wrong story)

[New Shooz]

you should have a word with your 'boss' and say that any changes in IT that have an impact on your CAD team require you to be part of the discussion / consultation; or else inefficiencies may occur. Make it out as though the company 'may' not make as much money if you are not a part of the process.

Sorry if it is a case of teaching granny to suck eggs etc

[jonesy]

Corporate decission nothing I can do...
My boss is aware of the problems as he has asked my opinions... and he's currently arranging to leave all current projects alone, and new projects to take the new structure. (again this could cause problems with users trying to find projects in the months to come)
All I can do is sit back and watch the fall out.

So, sort of back to my original question... which pathing method would be best (in peoples opinions) and why...
Does Autocad always default to full-path for xrefs?

Thanks for all input so far

[New Shooz]

Would it be worthwhile adding the value of PROJECTNAME to your drawings; then when the path of the xref's change, you can simply update the PROJECTNAME path and the xref's will automatically update themselves ?

I dunno; alternatively there is the Reference Manager; or a utility that was posted over at another CAD forum recently that allows you to find the all drawings that any other drawings are referenced into.

[craigr]

This is why I HATE XRefs!!

I tried them once, on ONE job, and didn't care for it, so I decided we weren't going to go that way.

Luckily, we can get by without them. I feel sorry for you folks that rely on them.

As for the IT part, we have a similar problem here at times. - Changes to the software, hardware, server apps, etc... without getting input from the CAD dept. We just have to deal with any problems that come up, though they may have been avoided by asking for input. - That being said, I DO acknowlege that they have a HUGE responsibility to keep things running smooth and secure at the same time.

craigr

[mjfarrell]

This is why I HATE XRefs!!

I tried them once, on ONE job, and didn't care for it, so I decided we weren't going to go that way.

craigr

XREFS are not that bad, or bad for you. Me thinks that if you worked with them a little more, with a little guidance as to the wherefor and why of XREF thinking, you would embrace them openly; and renounce this heresy.

[Bob Garner]

Like Randy, I think it's very important to have the 1README.doc file explaining what is going on in your archives.

Bob G.

[CADaver]

A chainsaw is a powerful tool whose proper use can make one extremely more productive than using an axe.  Improperly used a chainsaw can be considerably more destructive.

XREFs are an extremely powerful tool, and just like any powerful tool, they must be handled properly or the results can be extremely painful. 

Properly employed, they can enhance communication, improve accuracy, and reduce effort.  We would not function nearly as productively without them.

~~~~~

While we're executing a project, we have a much more detailed dirctory structure to assist designers in finding the files they need quickly.  Once we go to archive, this level of detail in the structure is not needed nor desired, so we greatly simplify the archival structure. This simple structure is also the structure in which we deliver the files to the client.  We've found that eTransmit in concert with a little bit of custom programming works quite well for us. 

[jonesy]

This is why I HATE XRefs!!

I tried them once, on ONE job, and didn't care for it, so I decided we weren't going to go that way.

Luckily, we can get by without them. I feel sorry for you folks that rely on them.

As for the IT part, we have a similar problem here at times. - Changes to the software, hardware, server apps, etc... without getting input from the CAD dept. We just have to deal with any problems that come up, though they may have been avoided by asking for input. - That being said, I DO acknowlege that they have a HUGE responsibility to keep things running smooth and secure at the same time.

craigr

We have engineers here who have used bind to bind the xrefs in as soon as they open them grrr... (they dont do that anymore ) but many of them are still uncomfortable using them.  Ejucashun is the key but saying that, you can only help the "willing to learn"... Me, I want to learn best practices... time savers... etc. and now I have to learn how to transfer all the projects without causing too much disruption

[mjfarrell]

You will love Sheet Sets....Built in Archive tool.

[CADaver]

You will love Sheet Sets....Built in Archive tool.

As long as you're working with "sheets".

[pmvliet]

I personally use relative path for my xref's. Normally all the drawing folders are under one job directory.
Those that xref across different jobs cause an issue. My thinking is that, the sub-folder structure
will remain the same once the project it archived.

In the case of Cadaver where they consolidate folder structure, then etransmit is a good tool.
Reference manager is also a good tool that will let you repath and turn a hard path into a relative
path. I use to use Reference manager a lot and wrote up a little "how to" to help my users at the time.
If you'd like to read it, let me know.

Pieter

Pieter

[Big G]

we have just gone through this process in work here, and talk about a PITA!....

eTransmit was mostly harmless, bar the duplication of a few xref's, but we were able to etransmit the entire job as one batch and seemed to be fine, though it did take an eternity to pack up!

try it on a small job first and unzip it to a different drive....

Good luck....sounds like youre gonna need it!